Whatever happened to American Patriotism?

[NorthwesternFan]

Whatever happened to the middle aged man who was willing to give his life for freedom? The woman who would do whatever she could to help her country? The American Dream?


Instead we have liberals who are drinking bottled water, and driving SUV's chomping at the bit to slam bush over every little thing even though the war, etc. affects their lives in no way.

Let me tell you Patriotism will be the downfall of this country. Americans take freedom for granted. Countries like Iran may be "third world", but almost everyone their is willing to die for their country.


So guys like nehemiah who criticize the government EVERYDAY! you will be the downfall of this nation..

I'm not the biggest fan of GW Bush and the Republicans, but it's our duty as Americans to support them..

You should be ashamed of yourelves!!

[uppy]

Outstanding Post NWF !

[nehemiah]

Whatever happened to the middle aged man who was willing to give his life for freedom? The woman who would do whatever she could to help her country? The American Dream?

Instead we have liberals who are drinking bottled water, and driving SUV's chomping at the bit to slam bush over every little thing even though the war, etc. affects their lives in no way.

Let me tell you Patriotism will be the downfall of this country. Americans take freedom for granted. Countries like Iran may be "third world", but almost everyone their is willing to die for their country.

So guys like nehemiah who criticize the government EVERYDAY! you will be the downfall of this nation..

I'm not the biggest fan of GW Bush and the Republicans, but it's our duty as Americans to support them..

You should be ashamed of yourelves!!:rofl:

this post is a joke. if you want to rumble in PRS - seriously, do better than this. otherwise your tenure will be short.

you're 17, right? i guess we can assume you will be joining the armed forces upon graduation?

[ckg68]

Enter the 9th circle of hell,NW Fan.

You're the type of person who'd be willing to put the blinders on,stick your fingers in your ears and scream LA LA LA LA! at the top of your lungs in your fevered dream that nothing is wrong-when,in fact,things clearly are.

I consider myself a patriot...and discussion and dissent IS patriotic,whether you like it or not.

[ckg68]

:rofl:

this post is a joke. if you want to rumble in PRS - seriously, do better than this. otherwise your tenure will be short.

you're 17, right? i guess we can assume you will be joining the armed forces upon graduation?

You know damn well he won't,nehe.

It's one thing to bump your gums on a message board that very few people will ever see. It's quite another to back up the words.

[uppy]

Don't fall for Neh's line of BS NWF,yours was an outstanding post,and he
can't answer.

[ckg68]

All it was,uppy,was a bunch of half-baked boilerplate crap to play to its base.

Which includes...YOU.

[uppy]

Enter the 9th circle of hell,NW Fan.

You're the type of person who'd be willing to put the blinders on,stick your fingers in your ears and scream LA LA LA LA! at the top of your lungs in your fevered dream that nothing is wrong-when,in fact,things clearly are.

I consider myself a patriot...and discussion and dissent IS patriotic,whether you like it or not.

ckg,dissent is patriotic....lol

[ckg68]

It IS.

Laugh all you want.

I don't give a :censor:.

[nehemiah]

bruins suck.

go find a golfcourse, poptart.

:D

[ckg68]

bruins suck.

go find a golfcourse, poptart.

:D

While we're at it...let's throw in the Red Sox,Celtics,Patriots and EVERY college team.

That should seal the deal.

[uppy]

The Bruins do suck..thay remind me of a football team in up-state NY

[uppy]

While we're at it...let's throw in the Red Sox,Celtics,Patriots and EVERY college team.

That should seal the deal.

Thats showing some dessent Ckg......lol

[nehemiah]

i hate the ****ing red sox.

2nd largest payroll in the league - and they bitch about the yankees. what a bunch of *******s.

[ckg68]

It's just my way of saying that Boston absolutely SUCKS!

[35Pete]

Whatever happened to the middle aged man who was willing to give his life for freedom? The woman who would do whatever she could to help her country? The American Dream?


Instead we have liberals who are drinking bottled water, and driving SUV's chomping at the bit to slam bush over every little thing even though the war, etc. affects their lives in no way.

Let me tell you Patriotism will be the downfall of this country. Americans take freedom for granted. Countries like Iran may be "third world", but almost everyone their is willing to die for their country.


So guys like nehemiah who criticize the government EVERYDAY! you will be the downfall of this nation..

I'm not the biggest fan of GW Bush and the Republicans, but it's our duty as Americans to support them..

You should be ashamed of yourelves!!
Actually this is an excellent post. OK to disagree with whoever is in power but still obligated to support them on the world stage.

I did with Clinton in Bosnia, all the while fighting his home agenda . LOL

[nehemiah]

seriously. boston sucks worse than jersey.

FACT.

[uppy]

Whatever happened to the middle aged man who was willing to give his life for freedom? The woman who would do whatever she could to help her country? The American Dream?


Instead we have liberals who are drinking bottled water, and driving SUV's chomping at the bit to slam bush over every little thing even though the war, etc. affects their lives in no way.

Let me tell you Patriotism will be the downfall of this country. Americans take freedom for granted. Countries like Iran may be "third world", but almost everyone their is willing to die for their country.


So guys like nehemiah who criticize the government EVERYDAY! you will be the downfall of this nation..

I'm not the biggest fan of GW Bush and the Republicans, but it's our duty as Americans to support them..

You should be ashamed of yourelves!!

Keep posting Sir.This post hit the nail on the head.

[ckg68]

Support,yes. But also critique and dissent when needed.

If you don't do both,you'll sound like a cheerleader.

[uppy]

seriously. boston sucks worse than jersey.

FACT.

Admit NWF post was outstanding.....stop the hijacking.

[ckg68]

Uppy: You already gave props to it once.

The last post was a parrot post. SQUAWK!

[nehemiah]

NWF's post was stupid.

drive-by patriotism. it's yellow ribbon time!

[uppy]

Can one of you lefties answer NWF post ?

[nehemiah]

Can one of you lefties answer NWF post ?when did you stop beating your wife, upstart?

[ckg68]

What is there to answer,uppy?

All that's there is ad hominem statements. Nothing more or less.

Remember...have a take,and don't suck. NWF doesn't(have a full-fledged,well-thought out),and he does(well,you know...;) )

[uppy]

when did you stop beating your wife, upstart?

You can't answer...lol

Ass kicked by a 17 year old young man

life is good

[nehemiah]

You can't answer...lol

Ass kicked by a 17 year old young man

life is good:D

:hmm:

i honestly have no idea what you're talking about. you having a sukie-type evening?

[ckg68]

Neither nehe's ass nor mine has been kicked.

Far from it.

But,hey,if you want to believe it,go ahead....whatever makes you feel good.

[uppy]

Neither nehe's ass nor mine has been kicked.



"NWF's post was stupid."


"Enter the 9th circle of hell,NW Fan."


True, you kicked your own asses.

[coastal]

Why these "jerk off" threads get any run is beyond me.

[ckg68]

"NWF's post was stupid."


"Enter the 9th circle of hell,NW Fan."


True, you kicked your own asses.

False.

All NW did was post ad-hominem statements,with nothing to back it up.

Notice,too,he's not even trying to defend himself. Just post and run.

[JLB]

The kids points are all unanswered maybe you guys should disappear you clowns know who you are. Nothing but pointless drivel he kicked your butts. Now say whatever and all those stupid type comments.Have a nice day you two.

[uppy]

False.

All NW did was post ad-hominem statements,with nothing to back it up.

Notice,too,he's not even trying to defend himself. Just post and run.

1) His post was about Patriotism ,and for over 200 years it has kept us free.
what back-up does he need ?

2) He may have ran because you boys attacked him...not his post,not his
words, but him.

NWF...keep posting

[ckg68]

1. Yeah. So has a lot of other things that's made America what it was. Your point is....?

2. Only a coward posts a thread and doesn't bother to defend his point. Pete doesn't pull this crap. Neither does shiva,nehe,etc.

All NW does is post some ad-hominem statements. That's it.

Just a case in point: "We have liberals who drink bottled water,and driving SUVs chomping at the bit to slam Bush over every little thing even though the war,etc. affects their lives in no way."

First: ONLY liberals drink bottled water? That's a load of crap.
Second: A lot of people drive SUVs,not just "liberals".
Third: I daresay that everything the goverment does affects our lives,directly or indirectly. And,BTW,try saying that "the war,etc. affects their lives in no way" to someone who actually IS serving overseas or their family and see what kind of response you get.

Memo to jlb: I'll disappear when I take my last breath.

[uppy]

1. Yeah. So has a lot of other things that's made America what it was. Your point is....?

2. Only a coward posts a thread and doesn't bother to defend his point. Pete doesn't pull this crap. Neither does shiva,nehe,etc.

All NW does is post some ad-hominem statements. That's it.

Memo to jlb: I'll disappear when I take my last breath.

He posted a thread:

And all you guys did was attack him.....if it was a drive by why did you
guys respond ?

[ckg68]

Because it was ad hominem. That's why.

I don't see Pete-for example-start a thread,then hit the eject button and see what happens. He contributes. NW hasn't.

[uppy]

Because it was ad hominem. That's why.

I don't see Pete-for example-start a thread,then hit the eject button and see what happens. He contributes. NW hasn't.

He has started to post and he has a few threads in the last 5 weeks.
I have enjoyed his posts,one was about Reagan.

Give him a brake,he has a point to make...I will show him respect.

[35Pete]

Because it was ad hominem. That's why.

I don't see Pete-for example-start a thread,then hit the eject button and see what happens. He contributes. NW hasn't.
In all fairness some people get away from the boards for a spell for a variety of reasons. But hit and run will get you clobbered around here, that's for sure. Because it boils down to just antagonizing. Maybe he is away for a bit? Who knows? If not, then he deserves grief for hit and run tactics, that's for sure. And if you do this enough then people just won't respond to your threads after a while. You become "persona non grata".

[35Pete]

He got off at 7:46. Don't think he hit and run.

[anEinherjer]

Whatever happened to the middle aged man who was willing to give his life for freedom? The woman who would do whatever she could to help her country? The American Dream?

I see plenty of them here in northern VA with the military bases and pentagon right around the corner. Many of them vote for democrats. Many of them hate the garbage in Iraq (which isn't a war. Last time I saw, Congress declared nothing of the sort). Iran isn't a war, shouldn't be, and probably won't be. So I don't know why you're even bringing it up.

Sorry, this post is bumper-sticker red-state rah rah nonsense.

Let me tell you Patriotism will be the downfall of this country.

I'm not sure I even understand what this means.

[nehemiah]

the post would read the same without the little "people like nehe" thing.

why would someone post that if they are not prepared to rumble a little bit?

[Ru]

Why does simple minded drivel like this even get a response from people who know better? Let them have their little circle jerk of ingorance if it makes them feel better. Responding to it only gives it validation in their minds.

[NorthwesternFan]

Fact is, the majority of soldiers who have inside information on the war support it. What maks your knowledge more valid than theirs nehemiah?

Face it nehemiah, complaining is senselss. You will never win.

[nehemiah]

Fact is, the majority of soldiers who have inside information on the war support it. What maks your knowledge more valid than theirs nehemiah?

Face it nehemiah, complaining is senselss. You will never win.:D

#1 i hope you will consider joining the military upon graduation... when you get that "inside information", come back and tell us all about it.
#2 are you running laps?
#3 where are the WMDs?

[Soviet_Canuckastani]

Support,yes. But also critique and dissent when needed.

If you don't do both,you'll sound like a cheerleader.

For Upstart and NWFan it's already too late.

http://americasbestonline.net/peoplemagspartans.jpg

[rob on the job]

Respectful dissent is crucial to a democracy ... but today's dissenters -- on both sides of the political aisle -- seem to be bent on destruction for their own personal satisfication rather than what is good for the country.

This was true during the Clinton impeachment and it is true now with the Bush-haters.

[35Pete]

People seem to be willing to hurt the nation as a whole in order to promote political gain. That is sad. Rob, your example is dead on.

[anEinherjer]

+1 Rob.

[nehemiah]

so posting on the buffalorange is hurting the country?

oy vey. talk about a martyr complex.

[rob on the job]

so posting on the buffalorange is hurting the country?

oy vey. talk about a martyr complex.

Of course not. Cut out the dramatics.

You know the difference.

[Mouldsie]

good post NWF, that's why pat tillman got off'd and deserved it. He was about to question the angry old men ordering him to die which is traiterous and unpatriotic. Our founding fathers would never have questioned their superiors in such a way.... oh... wait a second..... is that what the revolutionary war was....?..... nah



**** people like you. they make the world a depressing place to live sometimes

[Ru]

good post NWF, that's why pat tillman got off'd and deserved it. He was about to question the angry old men ordering him to die which is traiterous and unpatriotic. Our founding fathers would never have questioned their superiors in such a way.... oh... wait a second..... is that what the revolutionary war was....?..... nah



**** people like you. they make the world a depressing place to live sometimes

:thumbsup:

[Mouldsie]

Respectful dissent is crucial to a democracy ... but today's dissenters -- on both sides of the political aisle -- seem to be bent on destruction for their own personal satisfication rather than what is good for the country.

This was true during the Clinton impeachment and it is true now with the Bush-haters.
anyone who questions bush is only doing so for selfish reasons?
i guess if promoting the positive welfare of the nation is selfish then you may be right



tell me how bush is doing good for this country

[Merk]

good post NWF, that's why pat tillman got off'd and deserved it. He was about to question the angry old men ordering him to die which is traiterous and unpatriotic. Our founding fathers would never have questioned their superiors in such a way.... oh... wait a second..... is that what the revolutionary war was....?..... nah



**** people like you. they make the world a depressing place to live sometimes



+10

[uppy]

anyone who questions bush is only doing so for selfish reasons?
i guess if promoting the positive welfare of the nation is selfish then you may be right



tell me how bush is doing good for this country

Mr.Bush is standing tall and defending our Country despite the fact
he has taken the biggest beating I have ever seen a Prez take from
the liberal Press.Day after day it goes on,turn on CNN,ABC,NBC,CBS
its like reading the DNC web page.

In my State some schools have teams to stop young people from joining
the military.I don't recall that happening when Clinton was Prez..why?

[Mouldsie]

conservatives are lazy?

[RabidBillsFan]

In my State some schools have teams to stop young people from joining
the military.I don't recall that happening when Clinton was Prez..why?

That's because in the past, we either had a draft, or we could handle the optempo. Not this fight- it is sapping our strength militarily and economically...

[uppy]

That's because in the past, we either had a draft, or we could handle the optempo. Not this fight- it is sapping our strength militarily and economically...

In all due respect ...I don't see how this post has a thing to do with my
question ?

[uppy]

Respectful dissent is crucial to a democracy ... but today's dissenters -- on both sides of the political aisle -- seem to be bent on destruction for their own personal satisfication rather than what is good for the country.

This was true during the Clinton impeachment and it is true now with the Bush-haters.

Nice post

[ckg68]

Mr.Bush is standing tall and defending our Country despite the fact
he has taken the biggest beating I have ever seen a Prez take from
the liberal Press.Day after day it goes on,turn on CNN,ABC,NBC,CBS
its like reading the DNC web page.

In my State some schools have teams to stop young people from joining
the military.I don't recall that happening when Clinton was Prez..why?

Oh,yeah..."defending our country."

Ask the citizens of New Orleans and the Mississippi Gulf Coast if he's "defending our country." Ask the families of EVERYONE who died on 9/11 if he's "defending our country."

And I seem to think a certain man named Clinton got much more grief in the press than Bush has ever gotten. And why? Because dude(allegedly)got some. The press is reacting to stories that are already in the news cycle-they're not breaking major stories of their own.

Stephen Colbert has the press dead to rights,and his prize is getting belittled. Then again,Jon Stewart got grief for going nuclear on Crossfire-but the show ran out of gas and died. Stewart 1,Press 0.

[sukie]

You are illusional (credit to Chimp). Bush is pounded relentlessly. As far as Katrina/Wilma...Nothing (federal) is required according to the constitution . Act of God. 9/11? Act of a theology that wants Israel and the western infidels dead and will not rest until the ottoman empire is restored and allowed to manifest globally.

[Mouldsie]

Bush gets pounded as it should.... also the president deserves criticism.

[sukie]

yeah, he gets pounded because Loretta from W.VA can't affford gas for her 86 chevy cavalier. like that is his fault.

[nehemiah]

As far as Katrina/Wilma...Nothing (federal) is required according to the constitution:rofl:

[sukie]

point it out.

[shiva2999]

American patriotism would be hilarious if it wasn't so sick.

It lets every beer swilling, pork rind eating, trailer park living ignoramus feel superior because, gol dang it, they're citizens of the greatest country in the world!

[nehemiah]

point it out.:rofl:

[sukie]

point made, nehe.










by me.

[uppy]

American patriotism would be hilarious if it wasn't so sick.

It lets every beer swilling, pork rind eating, trailer park living ignoramus feel superior because, gol dang it, they're citizens of the greatest country in the world!

America is the greatest country in the world...and your country lives in peace
because thats a fact.

[nehemiah]

it is not in the constitution that bush should wipe his ass. he is one dirty mutha****er.

[shiva2999]

America is the greatest country in the world...and your country lives in peace
because thats a fact.

Capitalism likes the citizenry to be angry and stupid uppy.

It's easier to sell you crap if it comes wrapped in the flag.

[admarc]

For those of us that live in America, we are more than residents, we are Americans. America isn't united by a common ethnicity, ancestry or religion. We live in warm climates and cold, we live in mountain villages, deserts, farms, suburbs and cities. Some of us support Democratic politicians, some of us Republican, some stay independent and many others don't vote at all. There are so many things that exist that can forever divide us, but only one thing that unifies us all. It is the same thing that brought us together as a nation in the first place and what motivated our ancestors to leave their birthplace in pursuit of a dream. We are a nation unified by a simple idea, that all men are created equal and have a right to life, liberty and the pursuit of our own individual happiness, no matter what we define that to be.

The founding fathers knew that men are fallible. They understood that centralized power corrupts. They also knew that freedom unleashed would be the most powerful force on earth. Patriotism means understanding the principles this country was based on. It means praising those principles, teaching them to our children and defending them with our lives if necessary. Many men have made the ultimate sacrifice in defense of an idea. They deserve our deepest respect and gratitude.

There is nothing wrong with loving this country, even if you disagree with the micro policies of the current leaders. After all, the idea that is America was made possible by an act of rebellion. Our founding fathers valued freedom over life itself. The problem with too many modern day rebells is they lack a basic understanding of our founding principles. All too often protest is closer to a fashion statement than a legitimate call to arms in defense of freedom and the founding principles.

We all are sometimes guilty of taking for granted the wonderful gifts we have been given by those who came before us. To me, expressing your Patriotism is an act of giving thanks to those who defend our freedom and made the ultimate sacrifice. It is a show of support for those in harms way, regardless of weather or not you believe they should have been placed there in the first place. It is an opportunity to celebrate that which unites us, and at least for a moment not dwell on that which divides.

American Patriotism is an act of love and appreciation of our basic freedoms. It is not the cause of war, but it may very well be the difference between defeat and victory in a time of war.

[JoeMama]

Here's a quote for all you braindead Republicans to chew on.

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." -- Teddy Roosevelt

Plus, the term "patriot" was originally a slur against American revolutionaries.

However, they embraced the term since they were proud of their dissent & rebellion.

The real meaning of "patriot" is to oppose the governing class of your country on behalf of the interests of the people.

Real patriots would be disgusted with the Republicans on this website for such blatant groupthink.

[admarc]

Capitalism likes the citizenry to be angry and stupid uppy.

It's easier to sell you crap if it comes wrapped in the flag.

Capitalism is the honest exchange of the fruits of one man's labor, intellect, talent or ability for the product of another man's labor, intellect, talent or ability.

Capitalism thrives when a population is well educated, talented, intelligent, hard working and possesses vast individual freedoms. Stupidity, laziness and irrationalty are it's enemies.

[JLB]

Here's a quote for all you braindead Republicans to chew on.

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." -- Teddy Roosevelt

Plus, the term "patriot" was originally a slur against American revolutionaries.

However, they embraced the term since they were proud of their dissent & rebellion.

The real meaning of "patriot" is to oppose the governing class of your country on behalf of the interests of the people.

Real patriots would be disgusted with the Republicans on this website for such blatant groupthink.Please include all the braindead democrats so they can also chew on it. This country is made up of both.:shake:

[rob on the job]

...The real meaning of "patriot" is to oppose the governing class of your country on behalf of the interests of the people. ...

"Totalitarianism is patriotism institutionalized."
-- Steve Allen

"Patriotism is the virtue of the vicious."
-- Oscar Wilde

[sukie]

So Joe's definition is that patriots may only be the poor and unprivy.

[JoeMama]

So Joe's definition is that patriots may only be the poor and unprivy.

No, dipshit.

The "governing class" is simply the people who run the country or the government. Whether it by a monarch, a republic, whatever. The term "governing class" isn't about rich vs. poor, it's just a term to encompass any type of government or leadership that may be in power.

[rob on the job]

Joe, please remember TOS.

[sukie]

No, dipshit.

The "governing class" is simply the people who run the country or the government. Whether it by a monarch, a republic, whatever. The term "governing class" isn't about rich vs. poor, it's just a term to encompass any type of government or leadership that may be in power.
Uh, In this country is it not perceived that the "RICH" are in bed with the "GOVERNMENT" which would then be the "RULING CLASS"?

[NorthwesternFan]

My point is that lack of patriotism will be the downfall of this country. We have gotten so used to protesting wars in which we are the playground bully, that when there is a war between us and a country who is a legit threat; a threat to our freedom; a threat to end our empire, the liberal media will denounce the war, and influence liberals to protest instead of fight. As a result of the liberal media/protesters influences conscription will return. What's that mean? That means that we have unhappy, scared soilders vs highly motivated/prepared soldiers. We will lose.

The wars we have peformed poorly in, ie; World War 1(even though the allies won, America peformed poorly, and didn't have much of an influence in the victory), Vietnam, and now Iraq are all wars that were highly protested.

Wars like World War 2, Revoloutinary War, etc; wars in which people were motivated, and were not protested for the most part we were most successful..

As a result by complaining and being influenced by liberal media we are endangering national security.

[shiva2999]

My point is that lack of patriotism will be the downfall of this country. We have gotten so used to protesting wars in which we are the playground bully, that when there is a war between us and a country who is a legit threat; a threat to our freedom; a threat to end our empire, the liberal media will denounce the war, and influence liberals to protest instead of fight. As a result of the liberal media/protesters influences conscription will return. What's that mean? That means that we have unhappy, scared soilders vs highly motivated/prepared soldiers. We will lose.

The wars we have peformed poorly in, ie; World War 1(even though the allies won, America peformed poorly, and didn't have much of an influence in the victory), Vietnam, and now Iraq are all wars that were highly protested.

Wars like World War 2, Revoloutinary War, etc; wars in which people were motivated, and were not protested for the most part we were most successful..

As a result by complaining and being influenced by liberal media we are endangering national security.

There's a reason why logic isn't taught in American schools.

Capitalism loves illogic.

[shiva2999]

http://www.carefairs.com/carefairs/assets/product_images/product_lib/24000-24999/24795.jpg

Only $29.95.

Buy one or you hate America...

http://www.carefairs.com/carefairs/product.asp?dept_id=1701&pfid=24795&pop_product=1

[Mouldsie]

http://www.1115.org/archives/butters.jpg

aw, jee-whiz shiva, i don't hate america, well uh, i guess i'll buy it then

[pmoon6]

My point is that lack of patriotism will be the downfall of this country. We have gotten so used to protesting wars in which we are the playground bully, that when there is a war between us and a country who is a legit threat; a threat to our freedom; a threat to end our empire, the liberal media will denounce the war, and influence liberals to protest instead of fight. As a result of the liberal media/protesters influences conscription will return. What's that mean? That means that we have unhappy, scared soilders vs highly motivated/prepared soldiers. We will lose.

The wars we have peformed poorly in, ie; World War 1(even though the allies won, America peformed poorly, and didn't have much of an influence in the victory), Vietnam, and now Iraq are all wars that were highly protested.

Wars like World War 2, Revoloutinary War, etc; wars in which people were motivated, and were not protested for the most part we were most successful..

As a result by complaining and being influenced by liberal media we are endangering national security.I have to agree and disagree. I think patriotism is important, but not blind patriotism. Many people feel they are being patriotic by protesting, so when the right charges disloyalty because they dissent, it's wrong.

There is a reason the war is being protested. Just as in Vietnam, it's a political war. I didn't think so at first, but that's what it has turned out to be. Some people here with a little more vision, tried to tell us at the time.

[Angus]

Whatever happened to the middle aged man who was willing to give his life for freedom? The woman who would do whatever she could to help her country? The American Dream?


Instead we have liberals who are drinking bottled water, and driving SUV's chomping at the bit to slam bush over every little thing even though the war, etc. affects their lives in no way.

Let me tell you Patriotism will be the downfall of this country. Americans take freedom for granted. Countries like Iran may be "third world", but almost everyone their is willing to die for their country.


So guys like nehemiah who criticize the government EVERYDAY! you will be the downfall of this nation..

I'm not the biggest fan of GW Bush and the Republicans, but it's our duty as Americans to support them..

You should be ashamed of yourelves!!

Republicans don't drink bottled water or drive SUV's????

Bottled water sales in 2004 topped $8.3 Billion making it the second most popular commercial beverage in the US. Sales are pretty even around the country but due to the warmer climate and poorer water supply in the south, bottled water does even better in blue states. As for SUV sales, there are 20 Republicans in the California Assembly who SUV's but only 16 democrats who, nevertheless, voted for emissions standards that would take a lot of SUV's, even their own, off the road. The anti-SUV movement was started and continues to be led by the left though there are some republicans joining up.

If you must use a moronic stereotype to demonstrate your contempt for those who disagree with you, at least use an accurate one.

When you start out with that level of idiocy, you can't possibly expect to be taken seriously.

Time was, Germans figured that even though they weren't crazy about Hitler, it was their duty to support him. Bush is not Hitler, he isn't that smart, but loyalty without question to a "dear leader" is the unifying characteristic of every form of despotic government recorded in history. It is the absence of this trait that separates democratic republics from despotism in all its forms from communism to fascism to monarchy.

To suggest blind loyalty to a President, so that we can more closely resemble Iran for God's sake, is about the most un-American, un-Patriotic and cowrdly statement I have ever read. If you admire the blind loyalty so prevalent in Iran, by all means, move there. I am not so afraid of the terrorists and tyrants of the world that I am frightened into emulating them.

The cause that is right does not need blind loyalty to find its strength. The justice of that cause will bring it all the strength it needs to prevail.

[rob on the job]

I know that when people don't take pride in where they live, their home tends to look like shit.

Wonder if the same phenomenon occurs with a lack of patriotism.

[sukie]

Hey. if somehow it's Bush's fault my lawn looks like shit then I can say "F" patriotism.

[JoeMama]

Uh, In this country is it not perceived that the "RICH" are in bed with the "GOVERNMENT" which would then be the "RULING CLASS"?

The governing class, sukie.

The government, the monarch, the dictator. Whomever/whatever runs the country.

It's not about class warfare, it's about standing up on behalf of the people of a country to secure life, libertery, & justice against whomever/whatever may be an obstacle.

You don't have to hate the wealthy to be patriotic, that's your assumption, not mine.

If you don't understand something that unbelievably simple, don't bother responding.

[Angus]

The governing class, sukie.

The government, the monarch, the dictator. Whomever/whatever runs the country.

It's not about class warfare, it's about standing up on behalf of the people of a country to secure life, libertery, & justice against whomever/whatever may be an obstacle.

You don't have to hate the wealthy to be patriotic, that's your assumption, not mine.

If you don't understand something that unbelievably simple, don't bother responding.

It is hopeless. Some people have their politics stuck somewhere in 1969 where the whole world is divided between hippie, Berkely radical, pot smoking, tree hugging, commie-pinko-fags and god fearing American John Wayne-ish super-patriots. It is a self-idealizing world view that some can't resist.

You can't debate a person who has never heard a stereotype about the left that he didn't accept as gospel truth.

[rob on the job]

It is hopeless. ...You can't debate a person who has never heard a stereotype about the left that he didn't accept as gospel truth.

No offense, Angus, but this is an easy out for you.

[sukie]

Joemama, you said that patriots go against the ruling class. The rich rule by association and profit by that association, therefore, you were talking of the poor. it was a simple extrapolation. The rich don't want to go against themselves or their "richness".

[Angus]

No offense, Angus, but this is an easy out for you.

The alternative being what? Proving to him that just because I'm a democrat doesn't mean that I want to inspire the proletariat to cast off their chains and seize the government and the means of production from the ruling classes?

Really, if the level of debate is going to be an exchange of political catch phrases designed to appeal to those who would rather shout than think, count me out.

For example, I wouldn't bother explaining my views on abortion to someone shouting "baby killer" in my face. Pretty much a waste of time don't you think?

Now, if you'll excuse me, I have to drive off in my SUV while I swill a few bottles of water, or am I supposed to drive off in my limosine while I swill a few lattes? It's so hard to keep the inuslting liberal stereotype of the week straight these days. Between hating America, being a traitor and attending gay weddings, I don't have the time to keep up.

[Spacechimp]

The alternative being what? Proving to him that just because I'm a democrat doesn't mean that I want to inspire the proletariat to cast off their chains and sezie the government and the means of production from the ruling classes?

Really, if the level of debate is going to be an exchange of political catch phrases designed to appeal to those who would rather shout than think, count me out.

For example, I wouldn't bother explaining my views on abortion to someone shouting "baby killer" in my face. Pretty much a waste of time don't you think?

...

[K-Gun]

Joemama, you said that patriots go against the ruling class. The rich rule by association and profit by that association, therefore, you were talking of the poor. it was a simple extrapolation. The rich don't want to go against themselves or their "richness".

yeah, the founding fathers were "poor."

[sukie]

We're discussing modern patriotism. Jefferson, BTW, was doing OKAY in the wallet area.

[rob on the job]

We're discussing modern patriotism. Jefferson, BTW, was doing OKAY in the wallet area.

Never mind his success with all the sistahs.

[uppy]

I love seeing the word Patriot ,it reminds me of a Dynasty

[ckg68]

Yeah. Of a COUPLE YEARS AGO!

That time is OVER.

Back to NW Fan: Recall that when the whole fun with Iraq began,the entire media went along for the ride,with nary a dissenting voice even allowed to be heard anywhere in the media-'cause they were so shocked and awed by what we were seeing: war as video game. So that idea doesn't fly.

Of COURSE there was no dissent during the Revolutionary War...we were fighting for independence,NW!

Right now,I'd argue that with the forces we have stretched between Afghanistan and Iraq,we can't AFFORD to get involved in a 3rd conflict. The soldiers we have now ARE tired,are ill-equipped,and if God forbid you get injured in combat you run the risk of this country hitting you for the bill for the body armor that had to be left behind in order to get you medevac'd out.

[uppy]

For those of us that live in America, we are more than residents, we are Americans. America isn't united by a common ethnicity, ancestry or religion. We live in warm climates and cold, we live in mountain villages, deserts, farms, suburbs and cities. Some of us support Democratic politicians, some of us Republican, some stay independent and many others don't vote at all. There are so many things that exist that can forever divide us, but only one thing that unifies us all. It is the same thing that brought us together as a nation in the first place and what motivated our ancestors to leave their birthplace in pursuit of a dream. We are a nation unified by a simple idea, that all men are created equal and have a right to life, liberty and the pursuit of our own individual happiness, no matter what we define that to be.

The founding fathers knew that men are fallible. They understood that centralized power corrupts. They also knew that freedom unleashed would be the most powerful force on earth. Patriotism means understanding the principles this country was based on. It means praising those principles, teaching them to our children and defending them with our lives if necessary. Many men have made the ultimate sacrifice in defense of an idea. They deserve our deepest respect and gratitude.

There is nothing wrong with loving this country, even if you disagree with the micro policies of the current leaders. After all, the idea that is America was made possible by an act of rebellion. Our founding fathers valued freedom over life itself. The problem with too many modern day rebells is they lack a basic understanding of our founding principles. All too often protest is closer to a fashion statement than a legitimate call to arms in defense of freedom and the founding principles.

We all are sometimes guilty of taking for granted the wonderful gifts we have been given by those who came before us. To me, expressing your Patriotism is an act of giving thanks to those who defend our freedom and made the ultimate sacrifice. It is a show of support for those in harms way, regardless of weather or not you believe they should have been placed there in the first place. It is an opportunity to celebrate that which unites us, and at least for a moment not dwell on that which divides.

American Patriotism is an act of love and appreciation of our basic freedoms. It is not the cause of war, but it may very well be the difference between defeat and victory in a time of war.

Thank you for this post Sir:

[shiva2999]

Of COURSE there was no dissent during the Revolutionary War...we were fighting for independence,NW!


Don't be too quick to agree with him Carl. Of course there was dissent, massive dissent during the Revolutionary War. But it came from the right. All the "conservatives" were Tories, Royalists. The same types that defend George Bush today would have been pimping King George back then. FACT.

Read what Teddy Roosevelt has to say about it...

http://www.bartleby.com/171/10.html

Theodore Roosevelt (1858–1919). New York. 1906.

X. The Revolutionary War. 1775-1783.

THE year 1775 was for New York City one of great doubt and anxiety. All classes had united in sending delegates to the first Continental Congress. The most ardent supporters of the Crown and Parliament were opposed to the Stamp Act and Tea Act, and were anxious to protest against them, and to try to bring about a more satisfactory understanding between the mother country and her colonies. On the other hand the popular party as yet shrank from independence. The men who thus early thought of separation from Britain were in a small and powerless minority; indeed, they were but a little knot of republican enthusiasts, who for several years had been accustomed at their drinking-bouts to toast the memory of the famous English regicides. 1
With the summoning of the second Continental Congress this unity disappeared, as the Whigs and Tories began to drift in opposite ways,—the one party toward violent measures with separation in the background, the other toward reconciliation even at the cost of submission. A Tory mob tried to break up the meeting at which delegates to the second Congress were chosen, and were only driven off after a number of heads had been broken.

...more...

[uppy]

"All the "conservatives" were Tories, Royalists. The same types that defend George Bush today would have been pimping King George back then. FACT."

Conservatives of 1776 are the liberals of today...FACT

[shiva2999]

"All the "conservatives" were Tories, Royalists. The same types that defend George Bush today would have been pimping King George back then. FACT."

Conservatives of 1776 are the liberals of today...FACT

No.

Political parties may change philosophies but conservatives are always conservatives and liberals are always liberals.

The liberals were the revolutionaries uppy. The conservatives were Royalists. FACT.