Who should be bought out?

[LALAFONTAINE]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nhl/story/3756644

Good story from Foxsports. The Sabres are in pretty good shape. I wouldn't mind taking a look at several players, namely:

Zhitnik
Gonchar
Zubov (age?)
Palffy
Kovalev
Rafalski
Aucoin
Rathje
Pronger (if he isn't qualified)
Leetch (just because we can)
Naslund

I also wouldn't mind trading for Luongo, who's a RFA.

[pigpen65]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nhl/story/3756644

Good story from Foxsports. The Sabres are in pretty good shape. I wouldn't mind taking a look at several players, namely:

Zhitnik
Gonchar
Zubov (age?)
Palffy
Kovalev
Rafalski
Aucoin
Rathje
Pronger (if he isn't qualified)
Leetch (just because we can)
Naslund

I also wouldn't mind trading for Luongo, who's a RFA.


I would love to get Zhitnik back. In all honesty, how is it even possible to overpay a guy that plays 30 minutes a game? Techincally, he deserves half of the combined salaries for the other 5 defensemen. What would that work out to?

And pass on all the rest besides Aucoin. Or Pronger i suppose.

[TRIPLE P]

Aucoin and Naslund would be great Sabres

[Jeanneret's LaLaLa]

I would like aucoin, hes got one heck of a shot and is a big presence on the blue line and in front of our net.

[BanditsRock11]

Naslunds awesome, id take him over all of those guys

[sabrfan]

No way on Leetch, the Leafs already gave both thier arms and thier first born to get him. he is at the end of his career. besides i didn't feel he looked worth what the leafs gave up to get him. I would like Zhitnik, Acouin, Naslund or even Rafalski

[eSabre]

Zhitnik, Aucoin and Naslund.

Aucoin is a horse on the blueline. He can play in all situations, and can log a lot of ice time.

Naslund would be a dynamite addition to our deep forward corps.

I'd take Zhitnik back as well.

[Big Cow]

I'd like Zhitnik, Naslund, Aucoin and Palffy and probably in that order.

[matthew94]

Definitely some interesting names in the UFA and BUY-OUT sections of that article.

[TRIPLE P]

Naslund would be a dynamite addition to our deep forward corps.

.


He'd be the true Power Forward we've been lacking.

[LALAFONTAINE]

No way on Leetch, the Leafs already gave both thier arms and thier first born to get him. he is at the end of his career. besides i didn't feel he looked worth what the leafs gave up to get him. I would like Zhitnik, Acouin, Naslund or even Rafalski

I was being somewhat facetious. We can go after Leetch. The Queefs can't. And for 15 games of Leetch, that idiot Ferguson gave up:

Kondratiev
Immonen
2004 1st rounder (Korpikoski)
2005 2nd rounder

[Jeanneret's LaLaLa]

I'd like naslaund too but I think it's very unlikely. This guy has the potential to lead teh league in scoring and I think there are goign to be other teams that will be able to make more appealing offers than we can.

[BuffaloRanger]

Why don't you guys like Gonchar? Is he washed up?

[bduff54]

Owen nolan will almost certainly be bought out, so throw him in there. Leetch would still be a good pick up for any team, he was very good for those 15 games. Naslund would be an incredible pick up for any team, i just can't see him going ot Buffalo, sorry guys.

[LALAFONTAINE]

Why don't you guys like Gonchar? Is he washed up?

No, but he'd probably demand over $6M per, and Boston has more cap room than we do.

[LALAFONTAINE]

Owen nolan will almost certainly be bought out, so throw him in there. Leetch would still be a good pick up for any team, he was very good for those 15 games. Naslund would be an incredible pick up for any team, i just can't see him going ot Buffalo, sorry guys.

Why would we want Nolan or Leetch?

You may not see Naslund going to Buffalo, but you aren't Naslund. Over the past decade, the best UFA signed with what team? Buffalo.

[bduff54]

yeah but he wasn't a proven player at that point. He didn't have his pick of the league like Naslund will. why do you have to be so combative all the time. i was just saying leetch and nolan are availabe so add them to the list. I really think with the new CBA that players will factor in their marketability in the place they choose to play. Will Marcus Naslund make as much money on the side in Buffalo as he would in say New york or Toronto?

[The REAL Sabres]

Will Marcus Naslund make as much money on the side in Buffalo as he would in say New york or Toronto?Um, uh, um... Hello!! McFly!!

Ah, there's no use...!! :(

[bduff54]

what do you mean? i am talking about deals within the city, television etc. Tie Domi does millions of them here.

[BuffaloRanger]

Why would we want Nolan or Leetch?

You may not see Naslund going to Buffalo, but you aren't Naslund. Over the past decade, the best UFA signed with what team? Buffalo.

OK I must be really tired. Who was the UFA? Lafontaine? That as a long time ago.

I like Nolan's toughness. If the price was right...

I would love Naslund, but he's a potential 50 goal scorer, he will be way too much.. Plus he's talking of retirement. If he moves it could be to the ducks.

[BuffaloRanger]

Is JP Dumont a RFA or UFA? Is he worth bringing back?

[bduff54]

i think he is talking about dominek hasek. who else could it be? Yeah naslund to the ducks could happen considering the Burke connection.

[CNYSabresFan]

Is JP Dumont a RFA or UFA? Is he worth bringing back?

Ha ha ha ha, good one, JP Donothing. Whos next on your list, Chris Gratton??

[matthew94]

Dumont was a real solid player for us last NHL season

[buffjoe]

Let's get real goofy....... sign UFA's Mogilny, Turgeon, Andreychuk and Audette, then dress in Blue and Gold and move back to the Aud. Seriously though I see some role players that the Sabres could be interested in. Kovalev to play point on the PP. Gary Roberts or Adam Foote could provide some much needed grit. Brian Leetch might be revived under the more offensive rules. The goaltending situation is also interesting. We couldn't give any of the three away at the last trade deadline.Now they look pretty appealing in a cap situation.

[Forum21]

No, but he'd probably demand over $6M per, and Boston has more cap room than we do.
Then he's in for a rude awakening. I think he made like $3.6 in '03-04, so with the rollback, that would put him in a starting position of around $2.8. Yeah he's great, but I see him more around $4-5 in the new CBA, well worth the money.

Also, I fully expect boston to stay cheap and not knock the guy's socks off with an offer. Gonchar has no ties in this town, and may just as well leave, especially with the turn-over the B's are going to have.

Gonchar-Kalinin as your top paring? That would be sick...

And by the way, is Tallender in jail for rape, or what?

[Forum21]

Dumont was a real solid player for us last NHL season
he sure was.

[LALAFONTAINE]

yeah but he wasn't a proven player at that point. He didn't have his pick of the league like Naslund will. why do you have to be so combative all the time. i was just saying leetch and nolan are availabe so add them to the list. I really think with the new CBA that players will factor in their marketability in the place they choose to play. Will Marcus Naslund make as much money on the side in Buffalo as he would in say New york or Toronto?

Were you in a coma in the late 1990s?

Hasek was the MOST proven player at that point, having won several MVP and a ****load of Vezina awards.

He could have gone anywhere, including Toronto. He choose Buffalo over everywhere, including Toronto - especially Toronto.

The only thing Toronto has in spades over other cities is an over-inflated sense of its own self.

[LALAFONTAINE]

what do you mean? i am talking about deals within the city, television etc. Tie Domi does millions of them here.

Show us 5, rather than several million of them.

Then compare the coin some loser like Domi makes with the savings he'd see living in a lower tax locale (everywhere but Vancouver). Or compare the savings he'd see living in a place with lower real estate prices (most places, save NYC, Chicago, etc.).

How gullible are you Queef fans? Are you really so devoid of any connection to reality that you adhere to the fiction that every player in the NHL would prefer to play in Toronto? Consider Curtis Joseph's actions for a second, and then stop the crap.

[LALAFONTAINE]

OK I must be really tired. Who was the UFA? Lafontaine? That as a long time ago.

I like Nolan's toughness. If the price was right...

I would love Naslund, but he's a potential 50 goal scorer, he will be way too much.. Plus he's talking of retirement. If he moves it could be to the ducks.

Hasek.

And what has changed since 1998? Have the cities of Toronto and Buffalo changed that much? No, not really.

How tough is Nolan? He's made of glass. That isn't toughness.

Free agents will make their decisions based on $.

[LALAFONTAINE]

Then he's in for a rude awakening. I think he made like $3.6 in '03-04, so with the rollback, that would put him in a starting position of around $2.8. Yeah he's great, but I see him more around $4-5 in the new CBA, well worth the money.

Also, I fully expect boston to stay cheap and not knock the guy's socks off with an offer. Gonchar has no ties in this town, and may just as well leave, especially with the turn-over the B's are going to have.

Gonchar-Kalinin as your top paring? That would be sick...

And by the way, is Tallender in jail for rape, or what?

Who cares what his starting point is? His salary was based upon CBA limitations. You have a good point - there will be a lot of variability in expectations and actual salaries. I see Gonchar as an elite defenseman who will probably demand slightly less than the max.

Gonchar / Kalinin would not be a great pairing as both are LD.

Tallinder wasn't charged with rape.

[bduff54]

i think lots of players want to play in toronto. why wouldn't they? you are naive if you think differently. Every player wants to play in packed houses everynight. Sorry, when you referred to hasek i thought you meant when you originally got him.

[BuffaloRanger]

Hasek.

And what has changed since 1998? Have the cities of Toronto and Buffalo changed that much? No, not really.

How tough is Nolan? He's made of glass. That isn't toughness.

Free agents will make their decisions based on $.


So Hasek choosing to stay with team he was playing for was a major accomplisment? If given matching offers a player will usually stay with his team and not uproot his family. Besides at that point it was his team. He got the coach fired.

I agree, money will talk this offseason.

Nolan is not made of glass. He hurt his knee and missed the last 3 weeks of the season. Don't let your hatred of the leafs cloud your judgement. For years he was a great power forward.

Would you pay Nolan as much as Drury? Some team will pay him 2.5 mil.

Drury
GP G A PTS +/- PIM
76 18 35 53 8 68

Nolan
GP G A PTS +/- PIM
65 19 29 48 4 110

[The REAL Sabres]

He got the coach fired.Wrong. The coach he "got fired" was offered a contract extension that he declined.

[LALAFONTAINE]

i think lots of players want to play in toronto. why wouldn't they? you are naive if you think differently. Every player wants to play in packed houses everynight. Sorry, when you referred to hasek i thought you meant when you originally got him.

Toronto has higher taxes than all but two teams.

Toronto has crappy weather.

Toronto has expensive real estate.

Toronto has a extensive history of failure.

That's why they wouldn't want play there.

Packed houses? Who cares? They play half their games on the road anyway.

[LALAFONTAINE]

Wrong. The coach he "got fired" was offered a contract extension that he declined.

Like Babcock, except Babcock had a realistic view of his own marketability.

[LALAFONTAINE]

So Hasek choosing to stay with team he was playing for was a major accomplisment? If given matching offers a player will usually stay with his team and not uproot his family. Besides at that point it was his team. He got the coach fired.

I agree, money will talk this offseason.

Nolan is not made of glass. He hurt his knee and missed the last 3 weeks of the season. Don't let your hatred of the leafs cloud your judgement. For years he was a great power forward.

Would you pay Nolan as much as Drury? Some team will pay him 2.5 mil.

Drury
GP G A PTS +/- PIM
76 18 35 53 8 68

Nolan
GP G A PTS +/- PIM
65 19 29 48 4 110

I'd take Drury over Nolan, without doubt.

Nolan is made of glass. He's played 140 games in the past 3 seasons. He's missed over a full season.

Hasek's resigning as an UFA is important, since it shows that Buffalo can sign the most elite of players to free agent contracts. Players uproot their families all the time. Money talks.

[bduff54]

haha, extensive history of failure. Nice one.

[LALAFONTAINE]

1967.

[bduff54]

that is more the reason for a player to come to the leafs. If you can come here and be on the first leaf team to bring the cup to Toronto your would be a legend forever. You think the players think they can get that feeling in Buffalo?

[The REAL Sabres]

that is more the reason for a player to come to the leafs. If you can come here and be on the first leaf team to bring the cup to Toronto your would be a legend forever. You think the players think they can get that feeling in Buffalo?You think they couldn't?

[bduff54]

i am just saying that going to Toronto for a lot of hockey players is a great place to play. How can you deny that?

[MauvaisSang]

Some players I'd look at (for the right price):

Martin Lapointe
Brian Rafalski
Nikolai Khabibulin
Alexei Zhitnik
Adrien Aucoin

[MauvaisSang]

that is more the reason for a player to come to the leafs. If you can come here and be on the first leaf team to bring the cup to Toronto your would be a legend forever. You think the players think they can get that feeling in Buffalo?>>


Seeing as the Sabres have never won the Cup, I'd say they'd be a bigger legend.

[bduff54]

i think aucoin and Zhitnik would be good pickups for any team. Lapointe i am not so sure about anymore.

[LALAFONTAINE]

i am just saying that going to Toronto for a lot of hockey players is a great place to play. How can you deny that?

Because Toronto has higher taxes than all but two teams.

Toronto has crappy weather.

Toronto has expensive real estate.

Toronto has a extensive history of failure.

That's how you can deny that.

[LALAFONTAINE]

that is more the reason for a player to come to the leafs. If you can come here and be on the first leaf team to bring the cup to Toronto your would be a legend forever. You think the players think they can get that feeling in Buffalo?

Fred Robertson is a legend?

[bduff54]

man it is getting silly with this extensive history of failure thing. Everybody knows that the toronto Maple leafs have a great history in the NHl. You really think NHL players wouldn't come to Toronto because they are worried that their mortgage might be a few extra bucks a month?

[LALAFONTAINE]

man it is getting silly with this extensive history of failure thing. Everybody knows that the toronto Maple leafs have a great history in the NHl. You really think NHL players wouldn't come to Toronto because they are worried that their mortgage might be a few extra bucks a month?

Great history? 1967 is becoming the replacement for 1940. That's Queef history for you.

We aren't talking about a few extra bucks, we're talking about hundreds of thousands of dollars. If you don't think that matters, you are being deluded.

[bduff54]

ok fine the leafs are just like the hurricanes and the preadators. No player has ever come here to play because of the love for the leafs. Its an obsession here man, sold out crowd every night. there aren't many places in the NHl that do that anymore.

[LALAFONTAINE]

I've lived in that cesspool. That obsession has caused a few players to leave Queefdom (like Larry Murphy). The atmosphere in a sold-out ACC, quite frankly, sucks. My comparables? HSBC Arena, the Saddledome and whatever the hell Northlands Coliseum is called now, where I've seen games last season.

It is a package deal, and the primary determinants of whether someone chooses to sign is because of financial considerations. The amount that can be offered is equal for all 30 teams. What else affects total compensation? Marketing, which affects very few players. Toronto may have a slight advantage here. Taxes and real estate prices, which affect every player. Toronto has a huge disadvantage here.

[bduff54]

true but if we are talking about superstars. forsberg, naslund etc. Marketing could play a significant role.

[LALAFONTAINE]

Not really. Gretzky's marketing in Canada came from his time in Edmonton and LA, two cities outside of Canada, and one of which that is relatively small.

Lemieux's marketing in Canada came from his time in Pittsburgh.

What marketing has Brian Leetch done? Mats Sundin?

Superstars are going to be making more money, so disproportionate tax rates between the People's Republic of Ontario and say, Florida (with no state income tax) could be very dramatic.

And then there is cost of living comparisons:
http://swz.salary.com/costoflivingwizard/layoutscripts/coll_result.asp?presentsalary=5000000&presenthomemetrocode=119&presentworkmetrocode=119&newhomemetrocode=28&newworkmetrocode=28&currentlocation=119&newlocation=28&x=50&y=18

[bduff54]

sundin has done tons man. He has nike commercials etc, and he is always on the TV and Radio locally here in Toronto.

[The REAL Sabres]

and he is always on the TV and Radio locally here in Toronto.What the hell are you getting at?

Yeah, we don't have any radio stations and the only time we see/hear a Sabre talking is never. Wake up and smell the coffee bro.

[bduff54]

i meant promoting products and companies. I am not saying that dosen't exist in buffalo but it is just something a player might think about. By no means would it be the determining factor. I still think the fact the sabres haven't had a competitive team in a few years will still prevent top notch free agents from signing there. Just like it will be tough for Carolina, nashville etc to sign top dogs. Its just an opinion, maybe Darcy will prove me wrong and woo them in here.

[The REAL Sabres]

I still think the fact the sabres haven't had a competitive team in a few years will still prevent top notch free agents from signing there.In the capped (also) NFL, how do you explain London Fletcher, Takeo Spikes, Sam Adams, Jeff Posey, Trey Teague, Lawyer Milloy, and Troy Vincent??

Answer: They all saw/see the potential of the team and a means to make the money they want and think they deserve.

Random big name free agent, "Detroit and Toronto have been very (:rofl:) successful lately and will be able to give me the money I need to support my family."

Boy, are you in for a rude awakening.

Just like it will be tough for Carolina, nashville etc to sign top dogs. Yeah, Carolina and Nashville have no talent that will make a "top dog" say, "they aren't going anywhere." Or maybe they'll use the Sergei Fedorov factor... "Hmm, look how he helped contribute to the Ducks young talent." SOL for you.

Just like it will be tough for Carolina, nashville etc to sign top dogs. Its just an opinion, maybe Darcy will prove me wrong and woo them in here.Darcy woo?? Any idiot could woo someone here. Maybe even Hurls could. I hope (and actually know) Darcy will be diligent enough yet quick through this whole upcoming process.

[bduff54]

ok man, i will believe it when i see it. Prove me wrong thats all i can say. I still say the sabres miss out on the playoffs this year.

[LALAFONTAINE]

sundin has done tons man. He has nike commercials etc, and he is always on the TV and Radio locally here in Toronto.

All local stuff...like a bunch of Sabres like Stu Barnes, Jay McKee, Rob Ray, etc. have done.

[LALAFONTAINE]

i meant promoting products and companies. I am not saying that dosen't exist in buffalo but it is just something a player might think about. By no means would it be the determining factor. I still think the fact the sabres haven't had a competitive team in a few years will still prevent top notch free agents from signing there. Just like it will be tough for Carolina, nashville etc to sign top dogs. Its just an opinion, maybe Darcy will prove me wrong and woo them in here.

Why would it be tough to sign top dogs in Nashville?

Advertising? Just how much does a top dog (say a $5M+ player) make advertising?

Since Ontario has excruciatingly high taxes and Tennessee has no state income tax, we are talking about a 10% difference (or $500,000 after tax difference) in compensation. Your marketing department better be giving these guys million dollar deals just to compare with Nashville.

[LALAFONTAINE]

Yeah, Carolina and Nashville have no talent that will make a "top dog" say, "they aren't going anywhere." Or maybe they'll use the Sergei Fedorov factor... "Hmm, look how he helped contribute to the Ducks young talent." SOL for you.


Sergei Fedorov already signed with Carolina, but had to go to Detroit.

[LALAFONTAINE]

ok man, i will believe it when i see it. Prove me wrong thats all i can say. I still say the sabres miss out on the playoffs this year.

You will be proven wrong, and the enjoyable thing will be the depth of misery that the Queef fans will have to endure to simply become mediocre instead of horrific.

The Sabres won't miss the playoffs, and that will become very apparent once we sign some UFAs that everyone except you can understand.

[two4trippn]

What's Joe Thornton's future look like? Could a decent GM acquire him today with a top 5 pick trade?

[г]

Thornton is an RFA, so (if I remember correctly) depending on his last salary, any team signing him would have to give the Bruins 2 or 3 (or more) first rounders as compensation.

I'm not really up on the FA changes with the new contract, but at least that's where it was with the last CBA.

[Papaduke]

You don't sign Thornton you have to trade for him

[bduff54]

you said that 2 years ago lala and the sabres missed the playoffs and the leafs had 103 points. Come on man, we both know i will be right again.

[г]

You don't sign Thornton you have to trade for him

He's a RFA, the Bruins can match any offers he gets from other teams and they get compensating picks if he decides to leave Boston (at least under the old CBA) .

[г]

Yikes! I looked it up...

From the NHL faq on TSN, it says that the RFA system does not change, so they are using the last formula...

According to this page on TSN (http://www.tsn.ca/tools/print_feature.asp?fid=8993), Thornton would be a group II RFA

I checked the NHLPA website & he made 6.8 mil last year

If my calculations are correct, if another team made an offer and the Bruins chose not to match, then the Bruins would be getting 5 (yes five!) first round draft picks as compensation.

I'm not sure how the 24% rollback would work into the equation, though.

[LALAFONTAINE]

The rollback affects the issue of qualifying RFA.

[г]

OK, so likely (only) 4 first-rounders if you sign Thornton LOL

[two4trippn]

To me, the Sabres are missing a big man in the middle and a marketable asset, which Thornton is both. Could the Sabres have enough youthful assets to offer a trade which Boston couldn't reject without offering Vanek? Maybe this years 1st, Drury, Janik, and a Connolly or Pyatt? I'm just curious since the new CBA will make player values completely change, placing more emphasis on youthful value versus previous high priced talent.

[LALAFONTAINE]

At $6.8M, would you qualify Thornton? The max is $7.8M, and I wonder whether any player will be considered good enough to get that $7.8M. The talk around here is that the Flames will not sign Iginla to the max. In my opinion, he's the best player in the NHL. I might consider giving Luongo the max, but he has to play in the playoffs first.

[two4trippn]

Actually I think I'd take Thornton at that price simply to show the fans the club has the ability to pay for a franchise player. He would be the most marketable Sabre in many years. If it meant losing Afinogenov and Drury, certainly. What would be a fair breakdown to spend on your Top 2 lines, $12 -$14 mil??? We spent that previously on Satan and Hasek alone.
Iginla isnt a Center and we might have the same type of player in Vanek. Dumont has continued to improve and would damn good playing with a Thornton type. My question, what other players are Thornton's caliber at the same position and simliar age. Find me someone as marketable league-wide for less and I'm right there with you but he MIGHT be the biggest need for this club.