Memo to TD: Draft BWA in 1st

[finsrclowns]

The more I think about it, the more fired up I get about us getting ourselves a stud WR from this draft. And make no mistake, what we have with this draft is a most unusual situation. If it wasn't for the Clarett case allowing underclassmen into the draft we wouldn't have Larry Fitzgerald or Mike Williams available. And if they weren't in this draft Roy Williams would be a lock for top 3 and Reggie Williams for top 10. But they both ARE in the draft which means Buffalo gets a chance to choose a player that wouldn't normally be there at 13. One of the mocks I saw had SF taking Reggie Williams at 16 and the comment was "give him #81 and they won't notice the difference". If that's the case bring him on down to B-lo! That's not to say you don't listen to trade offers, but we WILL get a very good player if we make a choice at 13. I just hope his last name is Williams.

[Vessel17]

"With the 13th pick in the NFL draft the Buffalo Bills select... Ivan Williams, FB, from the University of Texas!?!?" ;)

[finsrclowns]

:rofl:

[Henry4MVP]

Mike Williams at 13 is the only Williams I want at 13.

Otherwise I want a Rivers, a Roethlisberger, a Smith, or an Udeze.

If that's not possible, I want a trade down and a Reggie Williams. :)

[BillsCAfan]

I would take R.Williams, M. Williams and Reg Williams in that order if I could pick.

For me, Mike Williams would be the best value at 13, while, R. Wiliams would be the absolute steal (I would trade up to get him, but not higher than 7 or 8), and for Reggie Williams, I think we can trade down 2 or 3 spots and still be able to pick him up.

[kdhammond]

Unless Mike Williams proves that he has the speed necessary to play in the NFL, I am not interested in him. By that, I mean that he must run AT WORST a 4.6 (adjusted for surface). If he doesn't run that well, then he could be nothing more than a glorified Shannon Sharpe - not quite a WR and not quite a TE.

Reggie Williams doesn't really do it for me, either. I don't see him as significantly better than any of the following, one of which will be available about pick 25:
Lee Evans, Michael Clayton, Michael Jenkins, Rashaun Woods.

Why take a WR at 13 that you could get equivalent value at 25? Additionally, I know I'll get shelled for this but, IMHO, WR is a second class position in the NFL. QB, OT, DT, DE and CB are much more important positions. So, if the players are of equal quality, why would you ever pick a WR over one of those positions?

Just my $.02 worth...

[Vessel17]

Originally posted by kdhammond
... If he doesn't run that well, then he could be nothing more than a glorified Shannon Sharpe - not quite a WR and not quite a TE.

Personally I'd be willing to take shannon sharpe at #13! This year (Which happens to be his 14th year in the league!!!) he caught 62 passes for 770 yards and 8 TD's. I'd love it if we drafted a WR or TE with those stats every year (assuming that a WR would naturally have more yardage... but still you get my point). At the same time I agree that if Mike Williams runs a 4.75 or something then we probably should look elsewhere AKA Reggie Williams :woo:

[kdhammond]

Josh Read caught 56 for 588 and Bobby Shaw had 750+ yards in receptions. I wouldn't pick either with the 13th pick.

[Vessel17]

Originally posted by kdhammond
Josh Read caught 56 for 588 and Bobby Shaw had 750+ yards in receptions. I wouldn't pick either with the 13th pick.

Neither Reed (or Read if you want to spell it that way) nor Shaw have proven themselves to be legitimate #2 threats. I know that this is Reed's 3rd year and WR's break out in their 3rd year. But I wouldn't mind picking up another WR in the draft... especially if his last name is Williams

[buffmaniac]

I don't want to get my hopes up but can you imagine this offense with Moulds, Roy Williams, Reed, McGahee, Henry, and maybe a TE like Watson in the 2nd. That would be awesome.

[Starter]

Ok, Mike William's 40 time is important, 4.5 should about do it, but he is one piece of monster WR that you may not see anytime soon. Reggie is fast and hard as hell to tackle and Roy at 4.38 claims he's faster because they had him change his stance in the workout. No way we pass up any one of these guys! The point that this may not come around for us is a good one. We must find a #2 guy that scares the other team in order to open up the other aspects of our game. If the're gone then ok, take DE Smith and pick up the best guy you can in the second round but fix this WR issue or our season could be hurting before it starts.

[kdhammond]

"Neither Reed (or Read if you want to spell it that way) nor Shaw have proven themselves to be legitimate #2 threats."

Thank you very much for calling out my typo. You are amazing and I am humbled to be in your presence.

Just for the record, I do know that his name is spelled Reed.

[kdhammond]

"Unless Mike Williams proves that he has the speed necessary to play in the NFL, I am not interested in him. By that, I mean that he must run AT WORST a 4.6 (adjusted for surface). If he doesn't run that well, then he could be nothing more than a glorified Shannon Sharpe - not quite a WR and not quite a TE."

OK, so now that Mike Williams has had his individual workout and ran about a 4.7 (adjusted down for the fast surface he ran on - see Profootballtalk.com), does anyone really think that he is worth the 13th pick?

IF they MUST pick a WR there, the Reggie Williams is the guy (unless Roy Williams were there), BUT I don't think that Reggie Williams is significantly better than any of 5 other WRs who will be available later in round 1 (Woods, Evans, Clayton, Jenkins, I am forgetting at least one other at the moment).

Either trade down for as much as they can get and still get essentially the same receiver later in round 1 or take Rivers or Smith/Udeze. I think that they could consider CB DeAngelo Hall or CB Dunta Robinson at 13, too.

Trading down is and has been my favored approach, assuming that any other team will offer anything.

[finsrclowns]

I'm not sold on Smith. I really want offense, but if Udeze slipped fine. Smith might not beat out Kelsay IMO. McGahee may be the next OJ, but the idea of drafting a player AGAIN in the 1st round that might watch this year isn't working for me.

[K-Gun]

Roy Williams speed is blazing: 4.37

he is big physical and fast... i think i would rather have him than M Williams 4.57 or Fitzgerald 4.63

[Vessel17]

Originally posted by kdhammond
"Neither Reed (or Read if you want to spell it that way) nor Shaw have proven themselves to be legitimate #2 threats."

Thank you very much for calling out my typo. You are amazing and I am humbled to be in your presence.

Just for the record, I do know that his name is spelled Reed.

Sorry I didn't mean to come of like a jerk... anyway defend your original post saying that either Reed and Shaw are viable #2 threats b/c I just don't see it

[kdhammond]

I won't suggest that Shaw is a good #2, but he is, IMHO, a good #3. Reed is *maybe* a good #2. If he doesn't show anything this year, then I'll agree completely that re-inforcements are required.

My point, though, isn't about Reed and Shaw, but rather the quality of the available alternatives. After Mike Williams ran a surface-adjusted 4.7, I don't see him as someone worth picking at #13 - in the mid-late 20s maybe.

I could be wrong about Reggie Williams, too, but I really don't see any significant difference between him and Mark Clayton, Rashaun Woods, Lee Evans and possibly Michael Jenkins. Given that, why not trade back in the first round (if there are any takers), pick up an extra 2nd or 3rd round pick and still get essentially the same player in round 1?

[Brandon]

Originally posted by kdhammond
I won't suggest that Shaw is a good #2, but he is, IMHO, a good #3. Reed is *maybe* a good #2. If he doesn't show anything this year, then I'll agree completely that re-inforcements are required.

My point, though, isn't about Reed and Shaw, but rather the quality of the available alternatives. After Mike Williams ran a surface-adjusted 4.7, I don't see him as someone worth picking at #13 - in the mid-late 20s maybe.

I could be wrong about Reggie Williams, too, but I really don't see any significant difference between him and Mark Clayton, Rashaun Woods, Lee Evans and possibly Michael Jenkins. Given that, why not trade back in the first round (if there are any takers), pick up an extra 2nd or 3rd round pick and still get essentially the same player in round 1?

The problem is that you really can't wait to see Reed play this year. If he doesn't play up to expectations again, then you've probably wasted another season, as well as one of the best WR drafts at the top ever. If you draft a WR in R1 and Reed steps up and plays well, then you've lost nothing except one of seven draft choices this year. In fact, you should have three excellent WRs that will make the offense very difficult to contain.

As for which WR to draft, I tend to agree with those that say there is not much difference in the 2nd group of R1 WRs. However, there is a big benefit to using the #13 on one of them. You get your choice of the group.

I would pick Reggie Williams there. He's got everything except blazing speed, but he's still got good speed for a big WR, and even then there might be potential for him to improve. He's probably 10-15lbs overweight right now. Get him down to about 215, and he might run consistently in the upper 4.4s (in fact, two of his five pro day 40s were in the upper 4.4s). That's pretty darn fast for a 6'4 WR. Another great thing about him is that he's only 20 years old (turns 21 a month after the draft), so there may still be considerable room for him to improve.

[kdhammond]

There are questions about Reggie Williams' work ethic and willingness to take coaching (at least that is what I've read).

If they can't get Roy Williams (and they won't), I'd be much happier with a trade down to take Evans and an additional choice. If they trade down and one of the Williams' is still there, then fine, but I am not totally sold on Reggie or Mike. I think that they are very good prospects, but not great. Maybe a smidge above Clayton, Evans and Woods, but not much.

[Vessel17]

Originally posted by kdhammond
There are questions about Reggie Williams' work ethic and willingness to take coaching (at least that is what I've read).


If I remeber right they said Moulds was too cocky and his willingness to be coached

[kdhammond]

Originally posted by Vessel17
If I remeber right they said Moulds was too cocky and his willingness to be coached

You are correct. He matured (or the comments were blown out of proportion to begin with). Clearly, Moulds has an outstanding attitude and work ethic.

None of us knows whether the reports that we read, even from reputable draft pubs (whose long-term reputations are on the line), are correct. There is also no way to really predict if some of theses cocky-poor-work-ethic guys in college will mature as Moulds did or remain immature pains in the a** like Ryan Leaf did.

I would always prefer the guy with the better attitude and work ethic over someone without that, even if there is a slight talent gap. The worker will usually prevail. Of course, if the talent gap is too big, that can't be ignored.

At any rate, I'd prefer a guy like Lee Evans who is both talented and has worked extra hard to overcome his knee injury (and been very productive in a tough conference, too). I'd also take a worker like Michael Clayton over Reggie Williams.

That is just my take. I don't have any way to really know what the talent differential is between Mike/Reggie Williams and guys like Evans and Clayton and Rashaun Woods, but I think it is pretty close to call. That is why I really would prefer to see the Bills trade down 5-10 spots and pick up an extra 2nd or 3rd pick PLUS get Evans, Clayton or Woods (or a good interior OL or Rivers if he were available later or ....)

[Awertzy]

Evans is exactly what the Bills need. In his 45 min workout he failed to drop a pass and he ran in the 4.3's. Our offense needs a burner (like Peerless Price) I think that Evans would make fans forget about Peerless real quick. By the way we would be able to pick up additional picks just to draft this guy. THIS IS IDEAL!!!

[Hurls]

what's BWA?

[Hurls]

nevermind