Kiper on Bills Draft

[N.Y. Orangeman]

Kiper discusses the Bills in his mailbag in the insider feature at ESPN.

To paraphrase:

Thhe upgrades at LB and DT allow the Bills to look at the WR spot, should they choose to go that way. Even with Josh Reed, the Bills need a third receiver. Currently Taylor Jacobs, Kelly Washington and Bryant Johnson are 3-4-5 and still fighting it out for position. At #23, the Bills will likely see 2 of these guys available.

:Barf: :toilet:

[RaidersFan]

i think that bryant will be a great player in the pros. I hope he falls to the raiders pick. That with a Safty would be another great draft for the raiders.

[RyDorf]

I can see us getting Jacobs. That would be nice addition. But I still think Mike Doss is a great idea too.

[N.Y. Orangeman]

Although I trust TD, I'd be disappointed if we didn't pick up a dlineman.

[nukedawg]

I feel real good about upgrades in the run D, but, there is still huge questions about the pass rush. We are gambling on guy's that are coming off injuries that their old team felt that it was better to let them go. And do we even have an interior pass rusher?

[dwightdrane]

yes...i agree w/ washington being frontrunner and biggest gamble but w/ leaders on this team washington could be kept in check.

[BANDITS]

I would go with Washington if we take a wide reciever at 23.

We don't need another SS with no pass coverage.

[askabry]

Washington or Bryant- fine. Six-three giants capable of jumping 36" + and running a forty under 4.4 don't fall on trees- especially with track records of great productivity at major colleges- don't ordinarily fall to 23.

I'd like a defensive lineman, but frankly the best beef will almost certainly be off the market by then. Joseph and Haynes are the two guys that could change my mind. But I don't believe they'll be hanging around then.

[Ryan Butch]

Michael Haynes would be my first choice at 23. I don't think he falls that far though. But then again, Josh Reed wasn't supposed to fall to round 2. Kelley Washington wouldn't be an awful pick, but he has a bit of an attitude, he is 23, and he just had neck surgery.

[Matthew J]

I actually like white from louisville. He hasn't gotten much mention, because of an off year this past year, but 2 years ago, he was an unstoppable pass rusher.

I heard he tried to play through injuries last year.

[dwightdrane]

a SS w/ coverage skills in a 4-6 de is not necessary. nice to have, yes, but not essential. We will be pressing the qb so much that we need a ballhawk, tackler, hitter, run stopper and a guy who knows where to be...

MIKE DOSS, tOSU

[mrprez2016]

If we choose WR
I think Washington is the guy if his physicals all pan out. He has been hurt the last couple years (leg and neck). But if he is there at 23 and he is healthy he will be a steal, he reminds me a lot of Donte Stallworth, he has the speed and the size.

But I think we should take Faine with the 23rd pick setting up a monster of a line and protect us if Jonas leaves as he has indicated is a possibility. Plus, Ruben isn't getting any younger... Jennings, Faine, Teague, Brown, Williams; now that's one mean and big line that will protect Drew from being sacked 50+ times, and open even bigger holes for TH to run through.

It would be nice if someone falls into the 2nd round that can play both DE/DT, or a good Safety like Troy Pomalu (yeah, i butchered his name) from USC.

[Hurls]

Kelley Washington is gonna be Randy Moss, Keyshawn Johnson, and Terrell Owens rolled into 1. If we can get him to keep his trap shut, he'll be a nice replacemant for peerless

[Phil3782]

How about a cornerback? We seem to be alright in every position so why not ad a good corner in are dime packages. That was a position that should be addressed at some point. Besides, AW is free agent next year, so it wouldn't be bad to have someone else in system just in case.

[TigerJ]

Among receivers near the top, I like the long term potential of Washington and B. Johnson. Among DEs, I think I like Haynes best. Among CBs Weathersby is probably the man. Among DTs I like Warren and Joseph best (Assuming Kennedy, Robertson and Williams are gone). We've got nearly another month to think about it.

[angneli]

If we take a wide out I like Taylor.

If we want a Safety we need Mathis

[mrprez2016]

One guy who i think might slip into the 2nd round and who would be an interesting pick is Woolfolk the CB from Oklaholma. He could become the 3rd CB and he can't be much worse than Watson was last year....

I think calling Washington a combination of Moss, Owens, and Johnson is a stretch. He doesn't have the bulk of Owens or Johnson, maybe his mouth is like all three of them but as far as talent i don't see it that fantastic. He is a good wr though and if TD thinks we need a WR then we should take him.

Still sticking with Faine to make a killer line....

[Range Roamer]

I think we are at the point of being able to stop looking for needs and take the best player available. When you have a chance to improve your team with quality players you don't take a chance on what you think will fit. Let's get guy's that could make an impact at their position for a long time. even if they can't start right now better players in practice are gonna make our starters better players in a game.

[RixBills]

I've been on the Washington (out of TN) bandwagon since I saw that fool play a few games last year! HE IS A STUD IN THE MAKING! If he's available, I'm willing to bet TD snags him.

Don't forget, Tennessee has been a breading ground for good/solid NFL Receivers lately. Peerless and Donte' Stallworth are 2 that come to mind off the top of my head.

[angneli]

Don't forget about Marcus "The Bust" Nash.

Rasheen Mathis would help improve our Turnover Ratio.

[D-Rocafella]

Everyone is saying that Washington is a better reciever then Stallworth. But Washington's question marks come from off the field.

[dwightdrane]

washington is a stud. will be a stud. but will his mouth and off field issues cause probs?

let's take a shot on em...

[D-Rocafella]

Even if we want to go WR in the 1st round and Washington is the guy we want he might never make it to 23. Thew Jets have the pick before us and chances are that they will pick up a WR. And Washington could very well be their guy. The only way they don't draft WR here is if Andre Johnson drops to them at 13, but I really don't see him falling out of the top 10.

[BuffaloRanger]

I think that MrPrez2016 is on to something. I like the way he thinks.

[jdesz36]

Originally posted by mrprez2016
One guy who i think might slip into the 2nd round and who would be an interesting pick is Woolfolk the CB from Oklaholma. He could become the 3rd CB and he can't be much worse than Watson was last year....

I think calling Washington a combination of Moss, Owens, and Johnson is a stretch. He doesn't have the bulk of Owens or Johnson, maybe his mouth is like all three of them but as far as talent i don't see it that fantastic. He is a good wr though and if TD thinks we need a WR then we should take him.

Still sticking with Faine to make a killer line....

Regarding Woolfork, I read a few things from the combine where it basically said he didn't do much to help his stock rise, but rather it actually fell a bit. He's only been playing corner for about two years, converted from a WR. He was Oklahoma's shut down guy, but playing in the Big 12 it's not like he was playing against the monster passing attacks of the SEC or PAC-10. My point is basically I'm not sold on the guy, don't know if he has the skills to cover NFL caliber receivers. I liked the kid Thomas that played nickel at the end of the season.

As for the combination of Moss+Owens+Johnson=Kelly Washington, I think he was referring more to the attitude/ego/mouth/etc. rather than talent.

[Tatonka]

Originally posted by dwightdrane
a SS w/ coverage skills in a 4-6 de is not necessary. nice to have, yes, but not essential. We will be pressing the qb so much that we need a ballhawk, tackler, hitter, run stopper and a guy who knows where to be...

MIKE DOSS, tOSU

there is zero chance of us taking doss, so you can stop dreaming..

we drafted our strong safety last year.. WIRE

wire is not capable of moving to FS.. and neither is Doss.. doss is all SS.. FS has to have coverage ability.. and he doesnt.. he is basically the same mould as wire..

there is just no chance we take him..

[N.Y. Orangeman]

I realize the importance of CB's, but I can't see the Bills wasting a pick on one in the first round for the following reasons:

1. Winfield will be resigned. We have a ton of cap room. We have a tag. Houston invested heavily in CB's. He likes money. No reason to believe he is going anywhere.

2. In Thomas and Watson, we have potential. Maybe potential disaster, but potential nonetheless. Both have the skills to man the position and we have needs elsewhere more pressing in the first round IMO. At pick #23, we aren't necessarily getting a player who will be better than those two next year.

3. If we really wanted to improve the nickel back position for a run this year, adding a rookie wouldn't cut it. If we really need one thing in this secondary, it is experience. A veteran like Terry Fair, Alex Molden, etc. would be just the thing this unit needs.

[SimpleTaSK400]

Everyone listen to exactly what tatanka said, he's 100% right(this is not sarcasm)

We definately don't need another SS with no pass coverage skills, especially not in the 1st round.

I'm not so high on Wire, but he did decent enough for the Bills to keep him there, I still would at least attempt to sign Sammy Knight, but I never would want Doss.

Doss is definately no Roy Williams, I hope he is not our pick.

Kelly Washington has caught my eye with his speed and size.

[angneli]

Originally posted by jdesz36
Regarding Woolfork, I read a few things from the combine where it basically said he didn't do much to help his stock rise, but rather it actually fell a bit. He's only been playing corner for about two years, converted from a WR. He was Oklahoma's shut down guy, but playing in the Big 12 it's not like he was playing against the monster passing attacks of the SEC or PAC-10. My point is basically I'm not sold on the guy, don't know if he has the skills to cover NFL caliber receivers. I liked the kid Thomas that played nickel at the end of the season.

He is not even the best corner on Oklahoma's team. He bites on double routes but that can be attributed to only playing corner for less than 2 years.

He did however play against some quality receivers and passing attacks. Including the Top 2 WR's for the upcoming season. One he did well against the other burned him for 210 yds and 3 td's.

[bad radio]

Originally posted by angneli
Rasheen Mathis would help improve our Turnover Ratio.

are you on this guy's payroll or something? :) I think every post I've seen from you in the last month has included some kind of reference to Rashean Mathis. I 'll have to check him out - where did he go to school?


in regards to the thread, I read that same thing on Kiper's Insider page. this is the first time I've ever truly felt like he has his head up his arse. I don't see any way they go WR, or any offensive position in the first round. it just does not make sense.

[askabry]

wow. I don't know about no offense...there are several players that would help in a big way including offensive linemen like Steinbach or if I was really dreaming, Harris. First choice would naturally have to be Haynes if he falls that far, or even a surprising DT.

But I wouldn't reach for a defensive linemen or cornerback and turn my back on, say, Kelley Washington.

[bad radio]

Kelley Washington is an injury-prone head case. why, when there's so much depth in the draft at DL positions and not any at WR positions, would they take anything except the best available DL? there will be plenty at #23, especially the impact DE we need.

[askabry]

not any at WR? This is supposed to be the best WR class since '83.

Washington, in any other year, would be a top ten selection. He's a legit 4.41, 6-3, 220 WR with a 38-39 VJ and good production at a major college.

Yeah, there's good dlinemen available. But if you are already onto the fifth best defensive tackle, or the fourth best DE or a compromise secondary player...then taking Washington- who outplayed Donte' Stallworth when they were together at school- is a viable option. Don't forget, you've got eight former NFL starters in your rotation on the Dline right now; you could go to battle with those players if Jones is healthy and be pretty darn good.

I'd go further than that; if the Bills don't address the #3 position at WR with a proven vet- and I don't mean Shaw- I think it's imperitive they get a very, very good WR in the draft. If Brandon Lloyd's available in the second, fine. But it's not chopped liver as a position of need.

[eyedog]

If the Bills are lucky enough to have K. harris fall into their laps then you take him. You can never have enough good tackles. You can then move Jennings back inside, especially next year when Ruben mat be on his way out.

[angneli]

Originally posted by bad radio
are you on this guy's payroll or something? :) I think every post I've seen from you in the last month has included some kind of reference to Rashean Mathis. I 'll have to check him out - where did he go to school?





He went to Bethune Cookman. He has had an obscene amount of Int's. I am not on his payroll, but I should be. I've made a lot of noise for him and Quentin Griffin.

[N.Y. Orangeman]

Ahh...I love this time of year. When friends are torn apart by players who are alumni (well, attended anyway) with less enrolled students than most people have posts around here.

[angneli]

Originally posted by N.Y. Orangeman
Ahh...I love this time of year. When friends are torn apart by players who are alumni (well, attended anyway) with less enrolled students than most people have posts around here.

Something against small schools? Look at his numbers. Games and combines.

[1968_bills_fan]

We have excellent starters at wide receivers and good depth with the recent signings. Reed is as fast as Price and is a running back when he gets the ball. Reed was the Bilnitnakov (sp) Award winner, which means the college people though he was the best receiver in college football. He should have gone in the 1st round. Adding another 1st round WR (even if he is backup or used in 3rd WR set formations) is an improvement- but only a slight improvement. What we really need is an upgrade at Defensive end (we have Schobel, two players who were let go from other teams (Jones & McKenzie) and two developing players (Denney & Irons). A stud 1st round pick would be a big and certain upgrade there and would improve the team more.

[N.Y. Orangeman]

Originally posted by angneli
Something against small schools? Look at his numbers. Games and combines.

Wasn't meant as an indictment on you, the players or the schools themselves. Just a statement on the fact that this is usually the most polarizing time of the year for fans of the same team.

That being said, I do think you have to look at the level of competition.

[Indiana Jim]

We need A stud DE. Jones is a fill in for a year or two while our first round pick develops. If jones or mckenzie surprise us so much the better. But, both are her for depth, insurance, and to tutor our 1st round pick on the nuances of the game. They also can help Schobel learn double moves. Too many times last year if his first move didn't work he was out of the play. the two vets will take him to the next level.

[pmoon6]

I disagree,I think Jones will comeback from his injury 100% and be a force to be reckoned with.I agree that Schobel will benefit from the vets.TD is going to draft a WR in the first round.IMHO

[Pedrorocks458]

Reed isn't as fast as Price.

[Bflojohn2]

If you read pre- combine write up on Jacobs (TSN) they said that the guy basically can't play worth a lick. If I remember correctly, it said " He has questionable desire and work ethic with suspect hands espcially in coverage across the middle and has trouble with the deep ball." If that is even remotely true then I don't want a guy like that on my team. Espcially the part about work ethic. That REALLY bothers me when a scout says that about a player no matter what the time of year the report came out! I already posted my draft a few weeks ago and gave my thoughts on what might happen and who the Bills might take.

[The Spaz]

Originally posted by Pedrorocks458
Reed isn't as fast as Price.

Josh Reed is stronger, bigger bulit and quicker but not faster. Reed also had a better ypc or yac I don't know off hand but it's one of the two but it was better than Price had. Josh will also break a lot more tackles than Price.

[bad radio]

I still think they need to consider a DT as well as DE. DE would be first on my list, but let's be serious about the Sam Adams situation - he is a band aid. he'll be around for 2 or maybe 3 years before he's released as either a cap casualty or ineffective or a combination of both. I would like to see a DE first, then maybe a safety in the 2nd, but would prefer a DT to develop. after that worry about the other holes, like backup RB. Lee Suggs could be around in the 3rd or 4th, and I'd take a chance on him.

but - it starts at the line of scrimmage. the D-line needs to be deep, healthy, and dominant.

[angneli]

Originally posted by N.Y. Orangeman
Wasn't meant as an indictment on you, the players or the schools themselves. Just a statement on the fact that this is usually the most polarizing time of the year for fans of the same team.

That being said, I do think you have to look at the level of competition.

I agree you do have to look at the talent level. And when you look at his numbers it was so far beyond that of everybody else. He should have been playing Division 1.

[BillsFever66]

What about Kenny Peterson. I believe he could play end or DT.

[Pedrorocks458]

Originally posted by The Spaz
Josh Reed is stronger, bigger bulit and quicker but not faster. Reed also had a better ypc or yac I don't know off hand but it's one of the two but it was better than Price had. Josh will also break a lot more tackles than Price.

I didn't say he wouldn't. I was responding to a post that said he was faster. I also don't believe he is quicker or as big of a big play threat.

[The Spaz]

Well then your full of BS...lol j/k but you are wrong just watch and see!:) Go Bills!

[pmoon6]

The addition of Gash shows what direction we are going.Ball control,smash mouth football.Teams are still gonna have to double Moulds and Reed can come underneath(Deja vous all over again)with Henry running draws,screens and off tackle. God ,I can't wait for the season.Draft Kelley Washington @ 23 and you have a lot of weapons.

[Losman2Moulds]

a stud dt would be great

the chances of pw and adams making it through 16 games is not likely and we need someone to keep those big offensive lineman off of fletcher. Also even if they both make it 16 games- they are not every down players. We need a stud DT to wwork in with them as a 3 man rotation to keep them as fresh as possible.

[santa barbara]

Originally posted by pmoon6
The addition of Gash shows what direction we are going.Ball control,smash mouth football.Teams are still gonna have to double Moulds and Reed can come underneath(Deja vous all over again)with Henry running draws,screens and off tackle. God ,I can't wait for the season.Draft Kelley Washington @ 23 and you have a lot of weapons.

I would go with D line too. If Sam Adams plays 16 games I'll be surprised. I hope so...but.

What about drafting a big time TE? I have no idea if there are any in draft, or any tucked away somewhere, but look at what Shockey did as rookie!?!?!?!?

I hope they use Gash more effectively than they did Centers. I never thought Centers saw the ball enough. Hopefully Gash will play a nice roll in bashing people, and catching a clutch 3rd down here and there. Even more so than he did first time through.

[BillsCAfan]

James Witten is Shockey like and is projected to go in the 1st. I have the Broncos taking him at 20 in my mock. Another good TE you would be able to find in the later rounds is Dallas Clark. He will be there for our 2nd pick, but 3rd rounder is pushing it.

[Henry4MVP]

I'd love to see Dallas Clark in a Bills uniform, but I just don't know if we need him.

[santa barbara]

Originally posted by BillsCAfan
James Witten is Shockey like and is projected to go in the 1st. I have the Broncos taking him at 20 in my mock. Another good TE you would be able to find in the later rounds is Dallas Clark. He will be there for our 2nd pick, but 3rd rounder is pushing it.

Dude. Nice CA logo (avatar ?) !!!

[Mouldsie]

Spaz, you forgot to add that Reed has much better hands than Price... probably th best hands on the team actually. (he's tougher and a better blocker too... he makes soem real tough catches in traffic, he made one of the sweetest catches of anybody on our team all season vs Oaklnad near the sideline w/ defenders all around him; it was about a 40-50 yarder and was beautiful to watch.)

[Mouldsie]

Spaz, you forgot to add that Reed has much better hands than Price... probably th best hands on the team actually. (he's tougher and a better blocker too... he makes soem real tough catches in traffic, he made one of the sweetest catches of anybody on our team all season vs Oaklnad near the sideline w/ defenders all around him; it was about a 40-50 yarder and was beautiful to watch.)

[Dex]

Originally posted by bad radio
are you on this guy's payroll or something? :) I think every post I've seen from you in the last month has included some kind of reference to Rashean Mathis. I 'll have to check him out - where did he go to school?


in regards to the thread, I read that same thing on Kiper's Insider page. this is the first time I've ever truly felt like he has his head up his arse. I don't see any way they go WR, or any offensive position in the first round. it just does not make sense. :burns:





You're absolutely right - Why would the Bills waste a first round draft choice on a guy who is a third stringer?? Do you not want a guy who can be a starter?? How about a guard to upgrade the o-line and give our quarterback a bit more protection and our ground game more punch?? If Eric Steinbach is there, ggrab him!