U.S. Advances to the World Cup Quarterfinals for the first time in 72 Years!!! [Archive] - The Buffalo Range, where the Buffalo fans roam!

June 17th, 2002, 9:33:12 AM

duff,

I'm also thinkin' Korea beats Italy...

England has been playing better than Brazil. I can easily see them beating Brazil. Similar styles in terms of hackage! Both are very aggressive and dirty teams. Should make for good viewing. :D

I can't stand the Brazilian, Argentinian, or Italian teams. Most of those guys should be in hollywood w/ the acting instead of playing soccer. It's always a circus of sorts w/ 11 hams on the field vying for fouls. An opponent makes a routine tackle, and there go the arms up in the air and a pained grimace while the guy lies on the groung and you're thinking he's through for the month. 30 seconds later he's making the moves like Pele. Unreal. England's dirty, but at least they tough it out and don't try to get the officials to win their game for them.

U.S., England, Japan, and Korea in the finals would be cool at this point. As long as Italy and Brazil don't make it I'm that much happier.

June 17th, 2002, 9:44:43 AM

Japan and Korea are overachieving ranked at 32 and 40...

bduff54

June 17th, 2002, 9:48:24 AM

korea are playing incredible. they pressure the ball like nobody i've seen before! I agree wys, i am proud that the Irish team don't lay down on every single play. although Duff did drop in the area for that first penalty

angneli

June 17th, 2002, 1:45:18 PM

Yeah, But they missed that PK anyway. The foul in the 90th minute was legit. I was rooting for Ireland. I think we have a shot with the Germans the only problem is they are going to have 2 more days of rest than us. I am looking for Donovan to have another good game. I don't think the Germans can run with him.

UK_BillsFan

June 17th, 2002, 5:25:18 PM

Britons are mad on football/soccer (as opposed to football/football as I call the US game), and beyond England winning the World Cup nothing would make us happier than the US knocking out the overachieving and arrogant present German team. Go USA!

I'm the Balm

June 17th, 2002, 5:36:23 PM

Originally posted by BillsMan80
Chalk up another Senegal rooter in me as you can tell by my avatar. I just love the way they play soccer...Wide Open and exciting.

That's what your boyfriend said...

The Natrix

June 17th, 2002, 6:00:09 PM

Good stuff. I went to sleep at 10:00, so that I could get up at 2:30 to smoke a doob and check it out........
crashed immediately after it ended

great game.

More entertaining than the hockey and basketball playoffs.

Although Kings-Lakers and Celtics-Sixers came close.

I was going to take our American Flag down, and replace it with a Yankees, but know it shall stay.

whats that?..............USA!

The Natrix

June 17th, 2002, 6:05:29 PM

I agree Billsman80.

it might be the sporting event of the year, barring a Bills SB win.....or appearance, I guess. God, if we lose to the Rams in the SB, would we be happy? The answer is yes, however we would take some serious trash talk, and I would be up for it. Especially with Fin Fans who watched their team lose in the first round.
Buc Fans and Charger Fans would also make for some interesting trash talk.

ddaryl

June 17th, 2002, 6:11:28 PM

All Ican say is

Holy _hit

never thought the USA could beat Mexico

I bet there are some seriously depressed Mexicans

Hell they'll probably kill have the team when they get home

The Natrix

June 17th, 2002, 6:29:21 PM

lmao

boco357

June 17th, 2002, 6:32:34 PM

I felt bad for that Old Irish guy in the front row. He was crying when the Irish's Robbie "don't call me Roy" Keane scored on the PK to tie the game vs Spain. But I think I may react the same way if Hollis kicked a 45 yarder to win the Super Bowl.

The Natrix

June 17th, 2002, 6:41:19 PM

what if he kicked a 59 yarder?

Judge

June 18th, 2002, 12:43:55 PM

Originally posted by wyswings
duff,

I'm also thinkin' Korea beats Italy...

U.S., England, Japan, and Korea in the finals would be cool at this point. As long as Italy and Brazil don't make it I'm that much happier.

Good start, but Japan bowed out.

Judge

June 18th, 2002, 12:44:50 PM

Originally posted by Tank
If the US miraculously won the cup... the best part would be that we beat all those other countries at the one thing they think they are better than us at... and we really dont care at all!

what suckers

Speakm for yourself. There are plenty of soccer fans out there in the US. It may not be as big as football, baseball, or even NASCAR, but a lot of people care.

boco357

June 18th, 2002, 12:55:49 PM

I care, I've been up for every US game live

Player6600

June 18th, 2002, 1:06:47 PM

Yesterdays USA win over Mexico was the greatest day of my life and has to be the greatest day in American history

John

June 18th, 2002, 1:27:55 PM

Originally posted by Player6600
Yesterdays USA win over Mexico was the greatest day of my life and has to be the greatest day in American history

Surpassing our previous greatest day, the glorious 3-1 defeat at the hands of Poland that got us into the knock out round.

Just wait until the US and South Korea make it to the semis!!!!:woot:

sotampacane

June 18th, 2002, 1:35:21 PM

Originally posted by Halbert
Now THAT would get Americans interested in soccer ...

I doubt winning the worldcup would do anything but have a very short term effect on soccer in our country.

When you get down to it, we don't care about soccer on a really deep level. Primarily because its about as interesting as watching grass grow. Never will be a major sport here. Never has and never will.

But if someone has to win this thing, it may as well be the americans.

Player6600

June 18th, 2002, 2:57:06 PM

angneli

June 18th, 2002, 3:27:56 PM

I see the rest of the cup breaking down like this.

England v. Brazil = This game will be a classic. Both teams are very good and won their last game rather easily. Brazil scores a lot but they allow teams to score as well.

England is a very strong defensive team. That has gotten better offensively in every game. England also has David Beckham. He is one of, if not the best player in the world. And he is absolutely fearless.

England wins a close one.

Senegal v. Turkey = Should be an exciting game. Both teams are completely nuts. I am going to take Senegal just because I think their speed will be too much for the Turks.

S. Korea v. Spain = Spain had better watch out. S. Korea comes at you with everything they have and they don't quit......ever. Spain should win the ball in the air. But they can't slow down for a miniute. Spain wins, but this one will be close.

USA v. Germany = If we force Germany into a game where they have to run with us. The US. will win. If we sit back and wait for the Germans to pick their shots and ultimately pick us apart we can't beat them playing that way. It would be like playing the Rams without blitzing. Coach Arena has been very smart so far, I think he will come up with a good game plan. The United States will win with Landon Donovan having a good game.

Judge

June 18th, 2002, 4:02:13 PM

Originally posted by sotampacane

I doubt winning the worldcup would do anything but have a very short term effect on soccer in our country.

When you get down to it, we don't care about soccer on a really deep level. Primarily because its about as interesting as watching grass grow. Never will be a major sport here. Never has and never will.

But if someone has to win this thing, it may as well be the americans.

Ridiculous.

Just because you don't understand the sport doesn't mean it's boring, buddy.

To the uninformed, football has to be hideously boring. Same with baseball. To those who understand the rules and strategy, it's very interesting. Soccer's the same way.

I don't know anything about cricket- its' a sport I don't follow. Is it boring? Maybe to me, but I don't write it off like your silly premise would.

As far as a "major sport"- you must be on the plus side of 50, huh? Well, it may never equal football, basketball, or baseball, but soccer should be a meaningful sport here for the long haul in some capacity. It lacks the tradition that we have for baseball and football giving the sport context - other countries grew up on it and have a similar historical tradition.

Judge

June 18th, 2002, 4:18:52 PM

Originally posted by reeves84
I found this an amusing but also interesting article:

http://worldcup.espnsoccernet.com/story?id=217566&lang=us

!2 step program to "Getting the Concept" of soccer.

The Twelfth Step
Deciding When Your Expectations Are Valid Enough To Blame The Team For Not Reaching Them.

.

I agree with this. This US team is full of seasoned vets who play in major international leagues and young stars getting valuable experience in MLS. This is not some rag-tag bunch of college all-star kids that the US threw together, like the 1980Olympic Hockey team.

This is no miracle team. It's about time this team finally started doing something. I didn't expect them to, am pleased that they're where they are, but am NOT SATISFIED!

Win, darn it!

:toast:

Judge

June 19th, 2002, 8:56:10 AM

Originally posted by Tank

Sure people care about soccer but we aren't nutty about it like they are in other countries.
There are 6 or 7 sports at least that American's care more about that professional soccer.
I am personally a soccer player and I enjoy the world cup - I just would find it funny as hell if we won.

I think you should stop using the all-encompassing "we" in describing the US sports fan. Alot of people care ALOT about soccer. I personally have followed international soccer since I was 13, and have been following English soccer in particular since about then. Soccer isn't my favorite sport, but I do care about it. Alot of people are staying up all night watching this tournament. I'm not, but many are. And now the casual fan is taking notice, at least of the results.

Soccer may very well be #5 or 6 in terms of ranking, but alot of people care about the sport, particularly in the realm of international play.

Player6600

June 19th, 2002, 11:17:01 AM

Originally posted by Tank

Would you be happier if I said that COMPARED to other countries, the average american doesnt care very much about soccer???

and by we I meant the other 98% of America

I think it's more like 99.5%.

Player6600

June 19th, 2002, 11:18:16 AM

apparently even the US soccer players don't even like the game there just doing it because it's their jobs. their just trying to make ends meet.

Judge

June 19th, 2002, 11:31:14 AM

Originally posted by Player6600
apparently even the US soccer players don't even like the game there just doing it because it's their jobs. their just trying to make ends meet.

Prove that point. Prove where any US pro soccer player said that. Totally ridiculous.

Just because you don't like it isn't a reason to criticize the sport. I hate auto racing. I find it boring, maybe because I'm not a car freak. But I don't make huge assumptions that "we" don't like it, or that it's a minor sport b/c it's arguably only 4th or 5th on the US radar after football, basketball, baseball, and golf. I don't criticize it or attempt to demean it by saying it isn't important b/c it doesn't measure up to football.

bduff54

June 19th, 2002, 11:45:26 AM

player you know nothing. you claim people in north america don't care. when was the last time you were in toronto? you sya you were here and noticed nothing about the world cup fever. 70% of people of their nations flag on their car and when south korea won yesterday it was madness. people do care wether you like it or not

naeliac

June 19th, 2002, 11:51:49 AM

I am so happy that Italy lost.

So very very happy.

Player6600

June 19th, 2002, 11:57:01 AM

Originally posted by bduff54
. when was the last time you were in toronto? you sya you were here and noticed nothing about the world cup fever. 70% of people of their nations flag on their car and when south korea won yesterday it was madness. people do care wether you like it or not

did you pull that number out of your @ss.

Judge- it's a joke everyone knows that. Also everyone knows that soccer is not very poular in NA.

bduff54

June 19th, 2002, 11:59:09 AM

no it was jsut a guess. but tons of people have flags. ask shiva he lives here. it is front page news. why do you pretend like it dosent' exist?

Player6600

June 19th, 2002, 12:04:08 PM

I'm sure there are soccer fans but the majority are immigrants.

angneli

June 19th, 2002, 12:14:45 PM

There are more soccer fans in North America than one might think. People like to watch the tape delay of the olympics, but when was the last time you saw a few thousand people cram into a stadium in the middle of the night to watch them.

This is happening in several cities in the US.

bduff54

June 19th, 2002, 12:17:11 PM

"they are all immigrants" lol. we are all immigrants you goon

MVDaBomb

June 19th, 2002, 1:05:39 PM

Originally posted by Judge

Ridiculous.

Just because you don't understand the sport doesn't mean it's boring, buddy.

To the uninformed, football has to be hideously boring. Same with baseball. To those who understand the rules and strategy, it's very interesting. Soccer's the same way.

I don't know anything about cricket- its' a sport I don't follow. Is it boring? Maybe to me, but I don't write it off like your silly premise would.

As far as a "major sport"- you must be on the plus side of 50, huh? Well, it may never equal football, basketball, or baseball, but soccer should be a meaningful sport here for the long haul in some capacity. It lacks the tradition that we have for baseball and football giving the sport context - other countries grew up on it and have a similar historical tradition.

Ridiculous is right...
As Jim Rome would say, "you're right, I don't get it....what's your point"? I played soccer when I was a kid and the majority of my friends are soccer fans, so it's not like I'm oblivious to the game. I just don't "get" 22 people running around for 90 minutes while never scoring, and then once you get to the championship round where relatively evenly matched teams play each other, the championship is decided on basketball's equivalent of foul shouts.
Not to mention, Wsy's description of the pathetic acting/diving done by the Brazilian and Argentinian teams...and the fact that those same traits apply to EVERY soccer team; it just makes my stomach turn. Basketball may have its share of actors too, but at least Kobe Bryant doesn't squirm on the floor and act like he got shot in the back with a magnum after driving to the basket. Don't tell me I don't understand that strategical part of the game because I do understand the concept of drawing a foul when nobody touched you....I just don't like it, and there is a difference.

bduff54

June 19th, 2002, 1:10:45 PM

i agree on the diving mvd it is a disgrace to the game. but now they are starting to crack down on it more. Totti for italy recieved his second yellow card and was sent off yesterday. that yellow card was awarded because he tried to draw a penalty by diving

bduff54

June 19th, 2002, 1:23:01 PM

no it wasn't. totti has built is own reputation and he now he has to live with it. the guy fakes injuries and dives all the time. the replay clearly showed the south korean clearly won the ball first and then totti dove

THATHURMANATOR

June 19th, 2002, 1:24:22 PM

O le ole ole ole O le O le ole ole ole
Or whatever those soccer hooligans yell

bduff54

June 19th, 2002, 2:27:22 PM

lol thurmanator. i think the english fans will be chanting..... "theres only one Micahel Owen, Theres only one Michael Owen"

Figurita20

June 19th, 2002, 2:28:30 PM

It's funny that people say that argentinians and brazilians are the only ones doing the acting/diving, every team from every country does that. I don't like it but that is just the way it is.

I can agree that we do it too often too exagerated, but everybody is doing it.

Instead of a yellow card I think a red card would keep this actors from dropping dead on the field.

bduff54

June 19th, 2002, 2:38:50 PM

no true figurita. you would never see an English or Irish player do what rivaldo or Totti did. Totti faked getting hit in the face yesterday, another player got a slidetackle against him that the whole world could see completely missed him and actually stayed on the sidelines and let the trainer look at him. you would never see roy keane/sol campbell do that

sotampacane

June 19th, 2002, 3:07:26 PM

Originally posted by Judge

Ridiculous.

Just because you don't understand the sport doesn't mean it's boring, buddy.

To the uninformed, football has to be hideously boring. Same with baseball. To those who understand the rules and strategy, it's very interesting. Soccer's the same way.

I don't know anything about cricket- its' a sport I don't follow. Is it boring? Maybe to me, but I don't write it off like your silly premise would.

As far as a "major sport"- you must be on the plus side of 50, huh? Well, it may never equal football, basketball, or baseball, but soccer should be a meaningful sport here for the long haul in some capacity. It lacks the tradition that we have for baseball and football giving the sport context - other countries grew up on it and have a similar historical tradition.

I have to remember, attack the post, not the poster.

What is written above is so blatantly wrong, its ridiculous. First of all, I know the game very well. I played it in the late 70's, and I was around for the first time soccer was allegedly going to penetrate the landscape (before dying its usual death). I remember watching Cosmos games with 70,000 plus in the meadowlands, so don't assume that you are the only one who has followed the sport.

Soccer people are such a freaking joke. If you don't bow down to there sport, 'you don't know the game'. That is so stupid. There isn't that much to know. Football is infinitely more complicated and far more strategy is employed. Get a new phrase because that other one is so tired.

And no, I am not over 50. But what if I were? Does that mean someone loses there right to think, have opinions and make sound judgements? By your post, should I surmise that you are in your 20's? Because most people in there 20's think they know everything, and soon will find out that they really don't know much about anything.

And as I heard today on Rome (go ahead and rip if you want), literally 'dozens of americans' are fascinated with the WC. I couldn't have said it better. A vocal minority in the US is all it is. The rest of us could give a flying...

bduff54

June 19th, 2002, 3:18:04 PM

sotampcne, i agree with your point on football being way more complicated than the soccer. but i have been following the world cup very closely and after the US beat mexico, i saw a live shot of people in virginia celebrating. Guess what there were hundreds maybe even a 1,000 paradeing the streets. and Canada is completely consumed by the world cup right now (ontarion anyway). so to say that "dozens are interested" is doing your country and north america a disservice!

Judge

June 19th, 2002, 3:32:32 PM

Originally posted by MVDaBomb
....I just don't like it, and there is a difference.

That's fine. You're entitled to that. But to mock the sport out is unfair in my opinion.

Judge

June 19th, 2002, 3:34:51 PM

Originally posted by sotampacane

I have to remember, attack the post, not the poster.

What is written above is so blatantly wrong, its ridiculous. First of all, I know the game very well. I played it in the late 70's, and I was around for the first time soccer was allegedly going to penetrate the landscape (before dying its usual death). I remember watching Cosmos games with 70,000 plus in the meadowlands, so don't assume that you are the only one who has followed the sport.

Soccer people are such a freaking joke. If you don't bow down to there sport, 'you don't know the game'. That is so stupid. There isn't that much to know. Football is infinitely more complicated and far more strategy is employed. Get a new phrase because that other one is so tired.

And no, I am not over 50. But what if I were? Does that mean someone loses there right to think, have opinions and make sound judgements? By your post, should I surmise that you are in your 20's? Because most people in there 20's think they know everything, and soon will find out that they really don't know much about anything.

And as I heard today on Rome (go ahead and rip if you want), literally 'dozens of americans' are fascinated with the WC. I couldn't have said it better. A vocal minority in the US is all it is. The rest of us could give a flying...

Yup- attack the post, not the poster. Learn the difference between "their" and "there".

If you don't give a flying.... so what? Just ignore the topic- why do you feel the need to mock out the sport? Why so insecure that you need to trivialize something that others enjoy?

Judge

June 19th, 2002, 3:39:58 PM

Originally posted by bduff54
"they are all immigrants" lol. we are all immigrants you goon

Bduff is right again. Godalmighty, where did you provincials come from? Open your minds and enjoy something that may not be the usual sport you watch. LEARN SOMETHING NEW! Soccer's a great sport if you give it a chance of watching it at the highest level in particular. The World Cup is HUGE.

There are interesting sports outside of the NFL and NASCAR, people!

bduff54

June 19th, 2002, 3:46:37 PM

thank you judge an open mind is what i like to hear. you guys make me laugh you won't give it a chance. look at me i move to canada in 1991 you think i had heard of the bills or maple leafs??? NO! but i gave the game a chance and realized that i liked it. if i had just ignored it and mocked it i would never have had those great moments the bills and leafs have provided me!

EricStratton

June 19th, 2002, 4:14:53 PM

There is a bit of a tone to this and all the other threads that if you don't like soccer you are ignorant. For the majority of folks that is just not the case. First of all separate the posters who spout off about soccer just to get a rise out of the BDuffs of the world. Just ignore the drival.

I find soccer dull to watch. I understand it very well, I made a point in college to get to know the game simply to be educated about it. It seemed very popular internationally and I wasted to educate myself so as not to miss out. (I also was trying to get into the pants of a female soccer player but thats not the only reason I got into the game). I know the rules, know the stratagy and appreciate the athleticism of the players. I also find a match on TV boring as all get out.

I don't want to speak for anyone else but that is most likely the opinion of an awful lot of people around here. Don't call me ignorant for not liking your sport. I am a fan of a few sports people find dull to watch (Swimming, triathalon, cycling) but I would never go so far as to think someone stupid for not liking them.

bduff54

June 19th, 2002, 4:16:37 PM

thats great eric. atleast you are honest and didn't just say soccer sucks and nobody likes it!

EricStratton

June 19th, 2002, 4:22:07 PM

Being in the NYC area soccer is huge. Not just for kids and highschools but pro stuff (MLS and Euro Leagues) as well.

Hell, in a few years I'll have to watch my kid play.

THATHURMANATOR

June 19th, 2002, 4:22:59 PM

Judge I have watched it and I still hate it!!! No offense though to you guys. If you like it that is cool. I could actually see myself having a great time if I was there because the crowds seem pretty crazy!!!! I just don't like the sport at all I have tried to watch some of these things because everyone here keeps talking about how great it is and I still didn't like it at all. It would be probably like trying to get someone from germany or something to come here and start watching baseball. They would probably think how boring it is, and I would sit there and say "How can you say that??" because I have played baseball my whole life and love the sport. That is why I feel these soccer arguments are wasting our time. Do you guys agree???

THATHURMANATOR

June 19th, 2002, 4:28:49 PM

Good point Reeves!!! I am probably the #1 time waister on this entire board!!!!!

THATHURMANATOR

June 19th, 2002, 4:50:45 PM

Well if you would have read my post (which I see you neglected to do) you would have seen that I in no way was putting people down for liking soccer. I don't care if you talk soccer here, and the time waisting I was speaking of was meaning the arguing going on about who should and shouldn't like soccer, but if you really want to be like that how bout going to the MLS board if you want to talk soccer because this is a FOOTBALL BOARD not a FUTBALL BOARD. Maybe you are confused.

THATHURMANATOR

June 19th, 2002, 4:58:22 PM

Ok sorry man I thought you were aiming that directly at me!!!

Sorry :toast:

Judge

June 19th, 2002, 5:15:03 PM

Originally posted by bduff54
thats great eric. atleast you are honest and didn't just say soccer sucks and nobody likes it!

Exactly. If you don't like it, fine. Just don't mouth off about how it sucks as a sport and how "WE" Americans don't care. Just speak for yourself, and leave it at that. I'm a bigtime soccer fan, and almost all if not all of my friends who are bigtime Bills fans love soccer too.

Judge

June 19th, 2002, 5:18:07 PM

Originally posted by THATHURMANATOR
Judge I have watched it and I still hate it!!! No offense though to you guys. If you like it that is cool. I could actually see myself having a great time if I was there because the crowds seem pretty crazy!!!! I just don't like the sport at all I have tried to watch some of these things because everyone here keeps talking about how great it is and I still didn't like it at all. It would be probably like trying to get someone from germany or something to come here and start watching baseball. They would probably think how boring it is, and I would sit there and say "How can you say that??" because I have played baseball my whole life and love the sport. That is why I feel these soccer arguments are wasting our time. Do you guys agree???

Yes I do. If you don't like it, fine- just don't insult the sport or the World Cup by saying nobody cares about it. I don't care at all about auto racing- I've gone to races, tried to watch it. I hate it.

ESPN's ratings for the World Cup are very high, particularly considering the games are between 2am and 9am ET. Obviously, alot of people care- maybe not everyone, but alot.

Judge

June 19th, 2002, 5:19:31 PM

Originally posted by Socalbillsfan
thurm, to answer your question, no, I dont agree.

I have no problem with people not liking soccer. The only time I ever pay attention to soccer is the world cup. I don't know why, but i love the world cup, I love all the national pride that people get. So i understand that people dont like watching soccer, as the only time I watch it is every four years.

But those people who dont like soccer feel a need to make stupid posts about how soccer sucks on some of these soccer-related threads. If you think us talking about soccer is wasting your time, don't open the soccer threads, because then YOU are the one wasting your time! If you dont have a comment on a thread, dont make one. It is unecesary to make posts saying how much you hate it.

I dont think those of us who like to talk about soccer are upset about people not liking soccer. What the "soccer bunch" does get upset about is that people are constantly posting about how stupid we are for talking about it and how dumb the sport is and why cant we just not make any posts about it. So then of course people start getting defensive.

THe easy solution to this is if you dont want to talk about soccer, dont talk about it! Just ignore it!

relinquishing the soapbox...:D

What a GREAT POST! Perfectly stated. Do you understand now, Mr. Sotampacane?

THATHURMANATOR

June 19th, 2002, 5:25:28 PM

"Yes I do. If you don't like it, fine- just don't insult the sport or the World Cup by saying nobody cares about it. I don't care at all about auto racing- I've gone to races, tried to watch it. I hate it."

I didn't insult anyone. NASCAR??? I may hate that more than soccer but it is close!

sotampacane

June 19th, 2002, 5:44:27 PM

Originally posted by Judge

What a GREAT POST! Perfectly stated. Do you understand now, Mr. Sotampacane?

Man, why do you have so much trouble reading? You are so hyped up over this its ridiculous. Why don't you go back to what I originally posted:

>I doubt winning the worldcup would do anything but have a very short term effect on soccer in our country.

When you get down to it, we don't care about soccer on a really deep level. Primarily because its about as interesting as watching grass grow. Never will be a major sport here. Never has and never will.

But if someone has to win this thing, it may as well be the americans.<

Judge:

Ridiculous.

Just because you don't understand the sport doesn't mean it's boring, buddy.

To the uninformed, football has to be hideously boring. Same with baseball. To those who understand the rules and strategy, it's very interesting. Soccer's the same way.

I don't know anything about cricket- its' a sport I don't follow. Is it boring? Maybe to me, but I don't write it off like your silly premise would.

As far as a "major sport"- you must be on the plus side of 50, huh? Well, it may never equal football, basketball, or baseball, but soccer should be a meaningful sport here for the long haul in some capacity. It lacks the tradition that we have for baseball and football giving the sport context - other countries grew up on it and have a similar historical tradition. {END}

Other than commenting on how boring I thought it was, I hardly ripped soccer at all. I then proceded to point out that I have followed the game, do know the strategy, and have played the game myself (albeit badly) in college. If anything, you ripped me falsely and erroneously, and then ask if 'I get it".

There isn't anything to get. Stop preaching about how those of us who don't like the game are ignorant and how WE should ignore the threads. Why don't YOU ignore any of our criticisms instead of firing back potshots that are misguided. I won't post anymore on the subject unless you do.

But my original premise sticks. Even with this World Cup run, it won't elevate soccer any higher up the sports food chain than it already is. It's behind the major 4 sports by a mile, and auto racing, tennis, golf, probably figure skating and gymnastics as well. It may make the top 10, but not by much. If that makes americans ignorant, well that is your opinion and you are entitled to it.

I am a long distance runner. But even I can tell you that I think watching running events on TV is not very interesting. Same goes for triathlon. Other than the Tour de France, cycling isn't capturing my imagination either.

If you choose to respond, drop the vitriol and read what I actually posted, rather than what you think I did.

Enjoy the games.

EricStratton

June 19th, 2002, 10:02:03 PM

Judge,

Why don't you get off you friggin' high horse and re-read any soccer related post I typed. Show me where I "mouth off about how it sucks as a sport and how "WE" Americans don't care.".

Your posts about this subject are exactly what I was writing about. Most people (BDuff, Reeves etc) talk soccer and defend the sport on its merits. You seem more interested in insinuating anyone who doesn't like your sport must be idiots.

To damn bad. People don't like soccer, live with it.

BigDoug

June 19th, 2002, 11:05:54 PM

What do you call a Portuguese fan after the first round of the World Cup?

Brazillian

bduff54

June 20th, 2002, 8:30:02 AM

lol big doug its so true.

Judge

June 20th, 2002, 12:25:31 PM

Originally posted by EricStratton
Judge,

Why don't you get off you friggin' high horse and re-read any soccer related post I typed. Show me where I "mouth off about how it sucks as a sport and how "WE" Americans don't care.".

Your posts about this subject are exactly what I was writing about. Most people (BDuff, Reeves etc) talk soccer and defend the sport on its merits. You seem more interested in insinuating anyone who doesn't like your sport must be idiots.

To damn bad. People don't like soccer, live with it.

Boy, if the truth hurts people react, huh? :poundu: Just joking- relax!

Listen, I was mainly speaking to Player6600, whose point was asinine, and to Sotampacane, whom I may have misread, and to whom I apologize for doing so. I agreed with you, Eric, and with Thurmanator.

If YOU don't like the game, that's fine. I'm not arguing that Soccer will ever replace any top American sport in any way. Just don't presume that "WE" Americans don't like it, or that "PEOPLE" don't like it, because there are many like myself who do. And I think the World Cup is a very cool event that even non-soccer fans could enjoy, as Socalbillsfan eloquently stated.

:usa: :usa:

naeliac

June 20th, 2002, 12:51:10 PM

The problem with soccer is that its weaknesses are football (which just about everyone on this board loves) strengths.

It is drawn out constant low intensity action, it has zero emphasis on strength and power, it is a very non-rugged sport, it is fractured and diluted as a professional sport, it has zero (or nest to it) contact, most of the game has no consequence on the outcome, it is not precise (arbitrary overtime and then they just stop playing and go to shootouts).

North Americans want to see the biggest and fastest and strongest athletes bleeding to win. Soccer just does not deliver that, it never will.

wagoncircler

June 20th, 2002, 12:57:59 PM

The 1980 US Olympic Hockey victory did't measurably boost the NHL's standing among the top four major sports in the US, and, in the unlikely prospect of a US World Cup victory, Soccer's status won't be affected much differently.

For one thing, there's no "Evil Empire" to defeat, so it's not as compelling a story. Secondly, few in this country would care to sit through the inevitable, interminable line of news stories about how much the rest of the world hates the US. We get it, OK, and we don't give a rat's @ss.

Soccer will always be the rest of the world's sport. We do things differently here, and we like it that way. Hate us all you want to, we get to live here.:patriot:

bduff54

June 20th, 2002, 1:00:39 PM

"we get to live here" congratualtions i hope you enjoy it. watch out for the stray bullets though. i will take where i am over where you are any day of the week

wagoncircler

June 20th, 2002, 1:14:55 PM

Originally posted by bduff54
"we get to live here" congratualtions i hope you enjoy it. watch out for the stray bullets though. i will take where i am over where you are any day of the week

Yeah, there are just bullets flying all over Cary, North Carolina. Hellhole. Violent soccer Moms. Thank God for bullet proof SUV's.

bduff54

June 20th, 2002, 1:20:14 PM

lol, i was just generalizing.

Judge

June 20th, 2002, 1:51:28 PM

Originally posted by naeliac
The problem with soccer is that its weaknesses are football (which just about everyone on this board loves) strengths.

It is drawn out constant low intensity action, it has zero emphasis on strength and power, it is a very non-rugged sport, it is fractured and diluted as a professional sport, it has zero (or nest to it) contact, most of the game has no consequence on the outcome, it is not precise (arbitrary overtime and then they just stop playing and go to shootouts).

North Americans want to see the biggest and fastest and strongest athletes bleeding to win. Soccer just does not deliver that, it never will.

That is not true- sorry, but if you really watch a soccer match, particularly at the World Cup level, there are long runs, very physical play, and the game is rugged and full of contact- I dare you to get in the scrum for the ball on a corner kick and risk the physical injury!

It does deliver what you're looking for. You choose not to see it. Your loss, but it's your right to not watch, just like it's my right to watch and state why I like the sport.

bduff54

June 20th, 2002, 1:55:27 PM

the problem with north america is we are fat asses!!! most of my friends can't watch soccer cause they need theor commerical breaks or intermissions, they need their nacho and beer breaks,. they need quick action instead of gradual tactics

Judge

June 20th, 2002, 2:03:37 PM

Originally posted by bduff54
the problem with north america is we are fat asses!!! most of my friends can't watch soccer cause they need theor commerical breaks or intermissions, they need their nacho and beer breaks,. they need quick action instead of gradual tactics

Great point. Bduff says it like he sees it, and tells it like it is!

:patriot:

bduff54

June 20th, 2002, 2:09:13 PM

hey i consider myself to be a north-american aswell i just think thats why alot of you can't watch it.

THATHURMANATOR

June 20th, 2002, 2:16:36 PM

Me not liking soccer has nothing to do with "beer and nacho breaks" Speak for yourself when calling us all fat asses!

wagoncircler

June 20th, 2002, 3:12:11 PM

Actually, subjecting us to sixty straight minutes of soccer is somewhat like the toothpicks in the eyes torture scene from A Clockwork Orange. English accents and all.

BironsGirl43

June 20th, 2002, 3:32:02 PM

Originally posted by wagoncircler
Actually, subjecting us to sixty straight minutes of soccer is somewhat like the toothpicks in the eyes torture scene from A Clockwork Orange. English accents and all.

90 minutes.. you mean? lol..

bduff54

June 20th, 2002, 3:35:12 PM

sorry thurmanator it is a proven fact that north-amerians are the fattest of all races! i'm sure you ahve a nice body though

John

June 20th, 2002, 5:36:08 PM

Originally posted by bduff54
"we get to live here" congratualtions i hope you enjoy it. watch out for the stray bullets though. i will take where i am over where you are any day of the week

BDuff - I have to ask, how long do you think you could stay there if we weren't here?

:D :usa:

angneli

June 21st, 2002, 10:53:56 AM

This thread has gotten so far off the point. I doesn't matter anyway the US. is out. So those people who don't like soccer can stop thinking about it until 2006. While those like myself who do enjoy the game can enjoy the rest of the World Cup.

naeliac

June 21st, 2002, 11:30:16 AM

Originally posted by Judge

That is not true- sorry, but if you really watch a soccer match, particularly at the World Cup level, there are long runs, very physical play, and the game is rugged and full of contact- I dare you to get in the scrum for the ball on a corner kick and risk the physical injury!

It does deliver what you're looking for. You choose not to see it. Your loss, but it's your right to not watch, just like it's my right to watch and state why I like the sport.

Long runs? When the the hell did I say there were NOT long runs? I said it was drawn out and low intensity.

"very physical play"

Compared to what, tennis? I compared it to football, yeah soccer is way more physical than football.

"rugged and full of contact"

Of course, how could I miss it? Diving so common that it is epidemic and falling down infront of someone is a tackle, so rugged and so full of contact.

You are being such a reactionary soccer evangilist that you did not even read my post. I did not even say soccer was good or bad, only why it won't be populer amongst football fans.

And you come back with soccer is rugged, and full of contact. Lots.

wagoncircler

June 21st, 2002, 11:44:02 AM

If soccer is rugged, I'm Shaquille O'neal

bduff54

June 21st, 2002, 11:45:11 AM

comparing soccer and football is stupid! Soccer fans will will say football sucks becasue it is so slow! My Dad for example can't stand monday night football because there is a commercial break every 5 minutes and i don't blame him!

naeliac

June 21st, 2002, 11:56:29 AM

Originally posted by bduff54
comparing soccer and football is stupid! Soccer fans will will say football sucks becasue it is so slow! My Dad for example can't stand monday night football because there is a commercial break every 5 minutes and i don't blame him!

Comparing soccer and football allows us to understand why US fans don't really like soccer.

Your statement above shows there is some resicprocity as well.

Saying things are stupid when you just don't under stand is stupid, and ignorant.

bduff54

June 21st, 2002, 12:05:39 PM

i just don't see how you can compare the two.

bduff54

June 21st, 2002, 12:12:56 PM

lol socal, i like it big guy

Judge

June 21st, 2002, 12:17:56 PM

Anyone who thought the USA-Germany game this morning was boring is nuts, in my humble opinion.

And anyone who chose not to watch this classic event because of their predisposition to soccer sadly missed out on a great match.

USA played exceptionally well at the highest level, against a top team. It's a shame they lost, but I'm proud of their effort.

You people who don't like soccer miss out- it's your loss!

angneli

June 21st, 2002, 12:32:08 PM

Judge I agree. We play great. Soccer is a game of inches and we came up a couple short. Landon Donovan will be the best the USA has ever produced. (If he is not already.)

angneli

June 21st, 2002, 12:59:41 PM

The Post is the goalies best friend.

John

June 21st, 2002, 1:06:02 PM

I'm very dissappionted that my two teams, England and the US, have crashed out of the World Cup.

If I might offer a slightly different perspective, a lot of the fun of the World Cup is not the game itself, but the fun of rooting for your country. The discussion in this thread about the merrits of the game vs. other sports is, IMHO, not getting to the heart of the matter.

The World cup is fun because so many people in so many places care about it so much. I think you have to be in one of those places to really appreciate this, however, and the US is not one of those places. Yes there is interest here, but in other countries everything stops when your team is playing. Its not about the game, its about nationalism and comraderie. If you have experienced the "event" of the World Cup in a place where it so big, I think you have a different outlook about the whole thing than if you haven't.

Whether the US ever gets to this point - who knows. What would get us there - who knows. But its the event, not the games, that is so compelling.

This is not too different from the way many Americans treat the Superbowl, BTW. They may or may not be surpreemly interested in the game itself, but the event (with its celebs and concerts and new commercials) is of interest.

I will follow the rest of the World Cup now, but it won't nearly be as much fun . . .

John

June 21st, 2002, 1:20:15 PM

Originally posted by Ebenezer
They got to the quarters...what more do you want? These teams lost to what might be the best two teams in the world...bad luck of the draw really.

Eb, you are right - the play of the US in particular was:fabulous1

I wasn't trying to say I was expecting more, just that I am sad to see them go!

angneli

June 21st, 2002, 1:54:58 PM

With all this said, who shall we cheer for now. I am still on too much of a high to just sit and enjoy the games. I say go Senegal and South Korea.

The ESPN radio guys are rooting for Turkey.

John

June 21st, 2002, 2:24:01 PM

Good Question, angneli!

Brazil - Can't go with them too big and too historically successful

Germany - Not a lot of sentiment for this team

Turkey - Can't see myself saying "I'm pulling for Turkey!"

Senegal - The underdog, but almost too well known an underdog at this stage - the fashionable unfashionable choice

Spain - A possibility

South Korea - The hosts

I vote for South Korea - France won it in France last time, so I'll stick with the underdog hosts and hope to see the whole country go crazy!

bduff54

June 21st, 2002, 2:27:48 PM

i want sengal or south korea to win it. if anybody else wins it i won't care. Brazil will be tough to beat!

direbills

June 21st, 2002, 2:32:25 PM

Originally posted by angneli
With all this said, who shall we cheer for now. I am still on too much of a high to just sit and enjoy the games. I say go Senegal and South Korea.

The ESPN radio guys are rooting for Turkey.

Brazil all the way!!!!!!

FlownTheCoop

June 21st, 2002, 2:32:26 PM

I think you'll see Germany and Brazil in the final. Today's games are more toss-ups, but I think that Germany will eliminate South Korea or Spain, and Brazil will eliminate Senegal or Turkey.

All my rooting interests in the U.S. and Ireland teams are gone, so I'm not too keen on the remainder of the field. I'd pull for South Korea as underdog hosts, but a lot of the anti-American stuff I'm hearing from there is kind of putting me off on supporting them.

bduff54

June 21st, 2002, 2:34:47 PM

yeh some of the fans have said they still don't like the states. ah well can't blame them. i'm sure there are plenty of american who dislike the japanese

FlownTheCoop

June 21st, 2002, 2:39:48 PM

Americans tend to be ambivolent about that sort of stuff. When I went to the World Cup in 1994 in Washington, the fans were more supportive of both sides rather than picking out a country to root against. It's not uncommon anymore to go to an NHL game in the States and see Russian jerseys, even though they were a bitter enemy a decade ago.

While I can accept that anti-American sentiment is inevitable worldwide, I think the fact that we have 37,000 troops protecting South Korea and their biggest reason for not liking U.S. is a speed-skating incident in the Olympics, that's pretty lame.

That's like the entire U.S. hating Germany for what happened in a sport today.

bduff54

June 21st, 2002, 2:42:56 PM

i hear ya flown, its just because the states is the biggest and in most cases the best. its just like how most of us hate the yankees or the Rams. everybody always hates the top dog!

FlownTheCoop

June 21st, 2002, 2:44:21 PM

duff-

Yeah, ever since the Soviet Union collapsed, we're the big kid on the block, so that's how it goes.

I could accept it over ideology, but SPEEDSKATING? :)

bduff54

June 21st, 2002, 2:47:41 PM

sppedskating is a pretty weak reason to dislike a country and the guy is half-asian anyway

FlownTheCoop

June 21st, 2002, 2:50:11 PM

I saw a poll where Koreans were asked the person they would least to see come to the World Cup - The results were:

1) Ohno
2) Bin Laden
3) Hitler

People, people, people...

bduff54

June 21st, 2002, 2:51:13 PM

that is funny!

FlownTheCoop

June 21st, 2002, 2:53:24 PM

I presumed that was in jest, but it sure is...

Sabre18

June 21st, 2002, 2:54:12 PM

this is a cool list of the all time best soccer countries...

http://www.worldcuparchive.com/NATIONS/maraton.html

I didnt know that Yugoslavia was ranked 8th all time, thats cool. Why arent they in this year, I heard they had a good team..

angneli

June 21st, 2002, 2:59:01 PM

I think brazil will win. I'm not cheering for 'em though.

John

June 21st, 2002, 3:19:03 PM

Originally posted by angneli
I think brazil will win. I'm not cheering for 'em though.

I agree

bduff54

June 21st, 2002, 3:36:30 PM

they should win, if they don't it will take a major upset. neither turkey senegal or even spain should have a shot at beating them. Spain on paper look good but in reality they are nothing too special

angneli

June 21st, 2002, 3:40:16 PM

Spain underachieves in every cup anyway. Raul is good. But I'm waiting for them to choke. They should already be out. Ireland out played them.

Judge

June 22nd, 2002, 9:38:13 AM

Originally posted by John
If I might offer a slightly different perspective, a lot of the fun of the World Cup is not the game itself, but the fun of rooting for your country. The discussion in this thread about the merrits of the game vs. other sports is, IMHO, not getting to the heart of the matter.

The World cup is fun because so many people in so many places care about it so much. I think you have to be in one of those places to really appreciate this, however, and the US is not one of those places. Yes there is interest here, but in other countries everything stops when your team is playing. Its not about the game, its about nationalism and comraderie. If you have experienced the "event" of the World Cup in a place where it so big, I think you have a different outlook about the whole thing than if you haven't.

This is a good take. I like soccer too, but the World Cup's magnitude, akin to the Olympics, takes the excitement/enjoyment of the event to a higher level.

June 22nd, 2002, 11:07:33 AM

It's even more awesome in countries where the entire country actually cares. I was in Germany for the '86 Cup and man it was beautiful. You could walk down the street and into any bar or restaurant and everyone was cheering for Germany. It was awesome. It would be like a World Cup of football where everywhere we were all rootin' for one team!

I think Germany v. Brazil will be a great match. IMO Germany has played better than their 10th ranking while Brazil hasn't quite played as well as their 3rd ranking. Both teams have plenty of experience and together they represent the two winningest teams in the history of the WC. I think Argentina is equal as well.

Should be a great matchup. I'll have to go to one of the Hispanic/Latino bars in the area to be the "German contingent" and to keep them honest... :D