What is a hate crime?

[C Darwin]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/chi-070610hatecrime-story,1,6739028.story?coll=chi-news-hed

What is a hate crime?
Some are asking why no media outcry over murders in which victims were white and suspects are black

By Howard Witt, Chicago Tribune senior correspondent, Published June 10, 2007

From the article...

What the statistics say...
On one hand, African-Americans bear the brunt of violent crime in the U.S.: In 2005, the most recent year for which statistics are available, blacks were more than twice as likely as whites to fall victim to serious violent crime, most often at the hands of other blacks.

Blacks are also the overwhelming majority of victims of attacks recorded by the FBI as hate crimes. In 2005, blacks were the victims in 68 percent of nearly 5,000 hate-crime incidents nationwide, while whites were the victims in 20 percent of the cases. Whites accounted for 60 percent of known hate-crime offenders, while blacks accounted for 20 percent.

But on the other hand, when overall cross-racial violent crimes are tabulated—including incidents not formally classified as racially motivated hate crimes—Justice Department statistics show that blacks attack whites far more often than whites attack blacks.

In 2005, there were more than 645,000 victims of cross-racial violent crimes between blacks and whites in the U.S. In 90 percent of those crimes, black offenders attacked white victims.

"In the old days," said Hutchinson, contemplating that statistic, "when you said 'hate crimes,' it was automatic—whites victimizing blacks. Today you have to pause for a minute and not make automatic assumptions."

[Green Lantern]

I think hate crimes are useless categorizations thought up by lawyers.

[Gibby]

I think hate crimes are useless categorizations thought up by lawyers.

well put, I think that all violent crimes are hate crimes. Why we need to specialize is beyond me. You burn a cross in someone's yard well you did vandalism so off to jail with you, same if you burn a church or home. Or if you kill, assault, or rape someone.

[г]

****ing bastard lawyers

[C Darwin]

The article also presents to us a statistical anomaly.* Of the 5,000 so-called hate crimes committed in 2,005, approximately two thirds were perpetrated by whites?* That is a strange one isn't it?* How could that be?** Somehow, white folks are always random victims of violence.

[Green Lantern]

The article also presents to us a statistical anomaly.* Of the 5,000 so-called hate crimes committed in 2,005, approximately two thirds were perpetrated by whites?* That is a strange one isn't it?* How could that be?** Somehow, white folks are always random victims of violence.

Whites make up about 2/3 of the population. I would expect them to be charged with about 2/3 of the hate crimes.

[gilchristfan]

well put, I think that all violent crimes are hate crimes. Why we need to specialize is beyond me. You burn a cross in someone's yard well you did vandalism so off to jail with you, same if you burn a church or home. Or if you kill, assault, or rape someone.

It was basically created as a sentencing enhancement in most states. The crime is the same, but if it was racially or religiously motivated, it carries a more severe sentence.

I don't know how effective they are, if at all.

Anyone read the article though? It has little to do with hate crimes. Shit, in this case you have 3 people charged with murder.

What they're crying about is the "media attention".

[TallskiWallski83]

watch south park more often, then you'll know what a hate crime is.

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/chi-070610hatecrime-story,1,6739028.story?coll=chi-news-hed

What is a hate crime?
Some are asking why no media outcry over murders in which victims were white and suspects are black

By Howard Witt, Chicago Tribune senior correspondent, Published June 10, 2007

From the article...

What the statistics say...
On one hand, African-Americans bear the brunt of violent crime in the U.S.: In 2005, the most recent year for which statistics are available, blacks were more than twice as likely as whites to fall victim to serious violent crime, most often at the hands of other blacks.

Blacks are also the overwhelming majority of victims of attacks recorded by the FBI as hate crimes. In 2005, blacks were the victims in 68 percent of nearly 5,000 hate-crime incidents nationwide, while whites were the victims in 20 percent of the cases. Whites accounted for 60 percent of known hate-crime offenders, while blacks accounted for 20 percent.

But on the other hand, when overall cross-racial violent crimes are tabulated—including incidents not formally classified as racially motivated hate crimes—Justice Department statistics show that blacks attack whites far more often than whites attack blacks.

In 2005, there were more than 645,000 victims of cross-racial violent crimes between blacks and whites in the U.S. In 90 percent of those crimes, black offenders attacked white victims.

"In the old days," said Hutchinson, contemplating that statistic, "when you said 'hate crimes,' it was automatic—whites victimizing blacks. Today you have to pause for a minute and not make automatic assumptions."

A hate crime involves motivation for the crime, not the fact that it was cross-racial. Do you agree with that?

[35Pete]

Whites make up about 2/3 of the population. I would expect them to be charged with about 2/3 of the hate crimes.

I believe proportionally though that drug use is higher among the black population. Therefore, I would expect them to have a higher rate of so-called "hate crimes" then their population would suggest.

To suggest that the crime rate is equally proportional to population fraction is a fallacy, would you not agree?

[35Pete]

A hate crime involves motivation for the crime, not the fact that it was cross-racial. Do you agree with that?

Stupid idea though, do you not agree? How easy is it to see into the hearts of men to truly know the motivation of their crime? Sure, it may be obvious on occassion, but how often? And what if someone is beaten over a robbery for money, and not because they are white or black? Is a cross-race crime automatically a hate crime?

Sounds like disproportionate justice to me.

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

Stupid idea though, do you not agree? How easy is it to see into the hearts of men to truly know the motivation of their crime? Sure, it may be obvious on occassion, but how often? And what if someone is beaten over a robbery for money, and not because they are white or black? Is a cross-race crime automatically a hate crime?

Sounds like disproportionate justice to me.

I don't know why this is always the objection; motivation is the standard for all sorts of crimes, e.g. murder. Easy? It is not easy. Maybe it is easier for whites to get convicted of hate crimes becuase they actually think the establishement will back up their racism whereas a black will shut up.

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

MURDER IN THE FIRST DEGREE
Murder in the first degree is the wilful, deliberate, malicious and premeditated killing of a human being. Malice, wilfulness, premeditation and deliberation, these four things, must co-exist before a defendant can be convicted of murder in the first degree. And the burden is upon the State of Alabama in this case to convince you gentlemen of the jury beyond a reasonable doubt, and to a moral certainty, that these four elements did co-exist before the defendant can be convicted of murder in the first degree, the highest degree of unlawful homicide.


Malice, wilfulness, premeditation and deliberation.

Gees that's too hard. Clear the prisons. And Manson too! What did he do anyway, say so and so should die? Let's call the thought police.

[35Pete]

I don't know why this is always the objection; motivation is the standard for all sorts of crimes, e.g. murder. Easy? It is not easy. Maybe it is easier for whites to get convicted of hate crimes becuase they actually think the establishement will back up their racism whereas a black will shut up.

Motive is only one aspect of a conviction. You can't convict on motive alone so why should you up the punishment on motive alone? You could be wrong in what's in the heart of the person doing the crime.

[ICRockets]

Motive is only one aspect of a conviction. You can't convict on motive alone so why should you up the punishment on motive alone? You could be wrong in what's in the heart of the person doing the crime.

Motive is a HUGE part of the equation, though. I mean, if we're looking at which degree we're talking about. 1st degree murder, I believe, has a necessary clause that the prosecution can prove a premeditation of the killing. To do that, you really need to look into somebody's motive. Some motives can easily be tied to the whole 'crime of passion' thing. I don't know. I'd be shocked if this makes sense, cause I'm pretty drunk.

[pmoon6]

Malice, wilfulness, premeditation and deliberation.

Gees that's too hard. Clear the prisons. And Manson too! What did he do anyway, say so and so should die? Let's call the thought police.What? You must be pulling our legs.

Manson sent the killers out with specific instructions.

On the second night, he made himself an accessory when he tied up Leno LaBianca so he could be stabbed 30 times.

You could consider the killings hate crimes because of the savagery involved. On second thought, probably not because the victims were rich white people and the killers were white, stoned out zombies.

[C Darwin]

The aspect that I find most intriguing is the disproportion between hate crime convictions (60/100 to 20/100) and interracial crime convictions (10/100 to 90/100). Why is it out of wack?

[Angus]

Stupid idea though, do you not agree? How easy is it to see into the hearts of men to truly know the motivation of their crime? Sure, it may be obvious on occassion, but how often? And what if someone is beaten over a robbery for money, and not because they are white or black? Is a cross-race crime automatically a hate crime?

Sounds like disproportionate justice to me.

There is nothing unusual about there being different punishments for the same basic crimes because they occurred in different circumstances. That is why a premeditated murder will result in a different charge and more severe sentence than a "crime of passion" murder. It doesn't mean that the victim is any more or less dead or that society values the victims differently. It is just a recogition that as bad as unpremeditated murder is, premeditated murder is even worse.

If you are going to object to crimes being treated differently when motivated by racism and the like, fine, just be consistent and advocate that we ignore all circumstances of the crime and punish all violators alike. Thus, a guy who steals a million bucks and the guy who steals a loaf of bread because he is starving should each recieve the same sentence. They guy who kills his wife to put her out of the misery inflicted by terminal cancer should get the same punishment as Sirhan Sirhan.

I think it is interesting that the right so rarely objects to taking into account many circumstances when determining the appropriate charge and punisment for a crime except when it comes to hate crimes, involving as they do race, sexual preference and religion (almost invariably religions other than christian ones). Just another crazy coinkydink.

[C Darwin]

I think it is interesting that the right so rarely objects to taking into account many circumstances when determining the appropriate charge and punisment for a crime except when it comes to hate crimes, involving as they do race, sexual preference and religion (almost invariably religions other than christian ones). Just another crazy coinkydink.

I think it is interesting how liberals avoid the issue of disproportionate charges of hate crime.

[mighty peace warrior]

its usually not to hard to find out the motivation behind a murder, the criminal will usually tell you or the situation makes it obvious. i don't find these numbers surprising at all. i would venture to guess that most crimes the victim and suspect are the same race, merely because races in this country seem to segregate themselves in different areas.

[mighty peace warrior]

I think it is interesting how liberals avoid the issue of disproportionate charges of hate crime.

look the reality is minorities rarely attack or do things to whites just because they are white. there are groups of white people out there who do things to minorities and brag that is why they did it. you are over thinking things a bit imo

[Gibby]

look the reality is minorities rarely attack or do things to whites just because they are white. there are groups of white people out there who do things to minorities and brag that is why they did it. you are over thinking things a bit imo

Quite true, how was your donut this morning?

[ICRockets]

There is nothing unusual about there being different punishments for the same basic crimes because they occurred in different circumstances. That is why a premeditated murder will result in a different charge and more severe sentence than a "crime of passion" murder. It doesn't mean that the victim is any more or less dead or that society values the victims differently. It is just a recogition that as bad as unpremeditated murder is, premeditated murder is even worse.

If you are going to object to crimes being treated differently when motivated by racism and the like, fine, just be consistent and advocate that we ignore all circumstances of the crime and punish all violators alike. Thus, a guy who steals a million bucks and the guy who steals a loaf of bread because he is starving should each recieve the same sentence. They guy who kills his wife to put her out of the misery inflicted by terminal cancer should get the same punishment as Sirhan Sirhan.

I think it is interesting that the right so rarely objects to taking into account many circumstances when determining the appropriate charge and punisment for a crime except when it comes to hate crimes, involving as they do race, sexual preference and religion (almost invariably religions other than christian ones). Just another crazy coinkydink.

Perfect. That 1st paragraph was exactly what I was trying to say in my drunk post. Thanks for sobering it up for everyone to read something coherent!

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

The aspect that I find most intriguing is the disproportion between hate crime convictions (60/100 to 20/100) and interracial crime convictions (10/100 to 90/100). Why is it out of wack?

Your assumption obviosly is that they would be equal. OK. Why is that assumption valid? Once we know, we can find out why it is out of whack.

[mighty peace warrior]

Quite true, how was your donut this morning?

change the pens in your pocket protector..or your material

[Gibby]

change the pens in your pocket protector..or your material

couldn't do that you peeler those pens are antiques. :D

[C Darwin]

Your assumption obviosly is that they would be equal. OK. Why is that assumption valid? Once we know, we can find out why it is out of whack.

I have made no such assumption, I was just looking for comments on WHY it is disproportionate.

look the reality is minorities rarely attack or do things to whites just because they are white. there are groups of white people out there who do things to minorities and brag that is why they did it. you are over thinking things a bit imo
How is this a reality? Remember, 90 percent of b/w interracial crime is black on white. I wonder if it’s just that simple (or even that true).

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

I have made no such assumption, I was just looking for comments on WHY it is disproportionate.


Oh my stones you haven't any idea what you wrote must be a Freudian slip.

[gilchristfan]

How is this a reality? Remember, 90 percent of b/w interracial crime is black on white. I wonder if it’s just that simple (or even that true).

Maybe this will help, if you're really just wondering.

http://www.tolerance.org/news/article_hate.jsp?id=497

An article written a few years ago from the Southern Poverty Law Center. Its discussing the article that you obtained your information from.

A few highlights:

Mistaking Poverty for Race
But Taylor is plainly, demonstrably wrong. Taylor uses an incredibly simplistic analytical method that flatly ignores the fundamental conclusion of decades of serious criminology: Crime is intimately related to poverty.
In fact, when multivariate statistical methods such as regression analysis are used, study after study has shown that race has little, if any, predictive power.
This basic fact is so well understood among scholars of criminal justice that the preface to Minnesota's official crime data reports carries this caveat: "Racial and ethnic data must be treated with caution. … Existing research on crime has generally shown that racial or ethnic identity is not predictive of criminal behavior with data which has been controlled for social and economic factors."
When more sophisticated methodology is employed, socioeconomic factors including poverty, education, social status and urban residence account far better for criminal behavior than race. Above all, income counts.
It is precisely because being black in America is closely correlated with being poor, suffering from high unemployment and having low levels of education that the black community has relatively high crime rates. For example, In 1994, the same year that Taylor's data comes from, the poverty rate among blacks was three times that of whites. In addition, nearly 40% of black children grew up in poverty.
So while it is true, for instance, that blacks rob whites far more than vice versa, that is hardly a surprise -- whites, after all, own nearly 10 times the wealth that blacks do on average. They also own far more businesses.


...

What Taylor actually does is consider only a subset of data on crime -- statistics on interracial crimes between blacks and whites from the National Crime Victimization Survey (NCVS). For crimes of violence -- the crimes Taylor focuses on -- that data covers just 16% of the crimes committed in 1994. The result is a skewed view of the impact of race on crime that suggests that whites ought to be terrified of blacks who, in Taylor's view, present a serious threat to society
...


...
But this analysis completely overlooks the larger -- and far more scientifically defensible -- pattern in the data: Most crime is intraracial (black-on-black and white-on-white), not interracial. In fact, the NCVS data show that 73% of white violent crime victims were attacked by whites, and 80% of black victims were targeted by blacks. This pattern is even clearer in the category of murder. According to a 1997 government report, 94% of black murder victims, as well as 85% of white murder victims, were slain by members of their own race.
Thus, the larger reality, that danger comes mainly from one's own race, is utterly ignored by Taylor, who for reasons of his own is interested only in interracial crime....



....

First, Taylor excludes hate crimes based on religion, sexual orientation and disability. Then, using the remaining motivation categories of race and ethnicity, he says that 63% of these crimes were committed by whites, less than their 72% proportion of the population would suggest; and 19% were the work of blacks, even though blacks account for only 12% of Americans. Thus, Taylor concludes, blacks are more likely to commit hate crimes while whites are less so.
These numbers are deceptive. If one looks at all hate crimes and all ethnic groups, the data show that whites are responsible for 75% of all hate crimes -- higher than their proportion in the population -- while the black rate remains at 19%. Corrected for population, these numbers mean that blacks are 1.37 times more likely to commit hate crimes than all other races combined -- a far cry from the 1.99 rate that Taylor advances.
...

[Green Lantern]

Did you know that the most expensive DVD's, The Criterion Collection, don't have those magnetic anti-theft strips in them?

Who is going to steal Seven Samurai?

[C Darwin]

Oh my stones you haven't any idea what you wrote must be a Freudian slip.
Still no comments on the issue? I’m shocked.

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

Maybe this will help, if you're really just wondering.
...

I don't think this is his question at all.

I think he has data on interracial crimes and those that are deemed hate crimes, and wonders why the hate crime number do not closely correspond to the numbers given for interracial crime.

To CD, there must be a reason there is a disparity, and CD is known to have a sensitivity to whites being victimized. Just read his posts.

So, until explained, this is a conspiracy by liberals to punish whites and coddle blacks, and to allow blacks to murder whites without penalty. Why, because, as a Liberal, I can say that this makes total sense :rolleyes2:

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

Still no comments on the issue? I’m shocked.

Well I believe this post will be #33. What are you expecting to be more than "no"? :rolleyes2

[C Darwin]

The FBI figures put the amount of crime committed by blacks against whites at about 3,000 murders a year and 15,000 rapes. This is quite a bit of human suffering inflicted on one race by another. These death tolls far exceed the Iraq war . Guilt riddled liberals will not comment on this.

Any police detective can tell you that one of the most crucial factors in a crime is “opportunity." In other words were “they” in that “place” at that “time.”

Ask yourself this: How many thousands of white people should die so that we can live in a forcibly desegregated society? The answer you give to that question will tell you everything you need to know about yourself. That question should also be asked every time someone is FORCED to wear the number 42 and treat it as a “wonderful” thing.

Those evil segregationists warned us about the problems that would occur if the social barriers that had kept whites and blacks apart were removed. More crime, violence, murder, a decaying social structure, the ruin of our institutions. Looking back those segregationists sound more like Nostradamus than the racist hillbillies that they were painted out to be by the MSM.

http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cache:4oSO5vnaa0oJ:www.amren.com/color.pdf+interracial+crime+statistics&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=5&gl=us&client=safari

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

This is quite a bit of human suffering inflicted on one race by another. These death tolls far exceed the Iraq war.

Guilt riddled liberals will not comment on this.

Any police detective can tell you that one of the most crucial factors in a crime is “opportunity." In other words were “they” in that “place” at that “time.”

Ask yourself this: How many thousands of white people should die so that we can live in a forcibly desegregated society?

Those evil segregationists warned us about the problems that would occur if the social barriers that had kept whites and blacks apart were removed.

http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cache:4oSO5vnaa0oJ:www.amren.com/color.pdf+interracial+crime+statistics&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=5&gl=us&client=safari

Truly sad!

I don't have your particular affliction, so your symptoms, expressed in English, don't make much sense to me. I am truly sorry you are so spun up. :(

Here is a blurb on the amren founder.

http://www.adl.org/learn/ext_us/amren.asp?LEARN_Cat=Extremism&LEARN_SubCat=Extremism_in_America&xpicked=3&item=amren

I am glad you came out as a supremecist though, because I thought you were at least inquisitive. Now I know you are just parrying and not really interested in answers from a sane point of view.

Good luck!

[Green Lantern]

The FBI figures put the amount of crime committed by blacks against whites at about 3,000 murders a year and 15,000 rapes. This is quite a bit of human suffering inflicted on one race by another. These death tolls far exceed the Iraq war . Guilt riddled liberals will not comment on this.

Any police detective can tell you that one of the most crucial factors in a crime is “opportunity." In other words were “they” in that “place” at that “time.”

Ask yourself this: How many thousands of white people should die so that we can live in a forcibly desegregated society? The answer you give to that question will tell you everything you need to know about yourself. That question should also be asked every time someone is FORCED to wear the number 42 and treat it as a “wonderful” thing.

Those evil segregationists warned us about the problems that would occur if the social barriers that had kept whites and blacks apart were removed. More crime, violence, murder, a decaying social structure, the ruin of our institutions. Looking back those segregationists sound more like Nostradamus than the racist hillbillies that they were painted out to be by the MSM.

http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cache:4oSO5vnaa0oJ:www.amren.com/color.pdf+interracial+crime+statistics&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=5&gl=us&client=safari


...

[gilchristfan]

...


double ...

[Papaduke]

If 2 guys get into a fistfight at a bar and they knock over my beer... that is a hate crime.

[C Darwin]

I am glad you came out as a supremecist though,...
What makes me a supremacist?

[Green Lantern]

What makes me a supremacist?

Well, at the very least, you are a racist. Right?

[C Darwin]

Well, at the very least, you are a racist. Right?
What makes me a racist?

"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." - George Orwell

[Green Lantern]

What makes me a racist?

"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." - George Orwell

an "-ist" is a person who sees things through that lense, predominantly. You like to discuss social problems vis. race; hence rac-ist.

It does not make you a bad person.

[gilchristfan]

I don't think this is his question at all.

I think he has data on interracial crimes and those that are deemed hate crimes, and wonders why the hate crime number do not closely correspond to the numbers given for interracial crime.

To CD, there must be a reason there is a disparity, and CD is known to have a sensitivity to whites being victimized. Just read his posts.

So, until explained, this is a conspiracy by liberals to punish whites and coddle blacks, and to allow blacks to murder whites without penalty. Why, because, as a Liberal, I can say that this makes total sense :rolleyes2:

Well, it did, if he was interested in reading it. I had a feeling he really wasn't, though.

That, "The Color of Crime" article (the one he cited in a later post) has been floating around in white hate group circles for years. I suspected that's where he got the 90% figure. Turns out I was right.

[C Darwin]

an "-ist" is a person who sees things through that lense, predominantly. You like to discuss social problems vis. race; hence rac-ist.

It does not make you a bad person.

The term commonly used for your definition is a racialist. I do like to blog about racial issues from a viewpoint that has been forbidden by the MSM. My primary lens in which I view the world is the survivability of my children. I politic and try to gather support to end our Euro-American second-class citizenship under affirmative action rulings and minority government entitlements. The only thing I want is for my children to not be discriminated against. I want them to have equal access to all jobs, college enrollment, loans, contracts, scholarships, educational opportunities, and for them to be safe.

[Green Lantern]

The term commonly used for your definition is a racialist. I do like to blog about racial issues from a viewpoint that has been forbidden by the MSM. My primary lens in which I view the world is the survivability of my children. I politic and try to gather support to end our Euro-American second-class citizenship under affirmative action rulings and minority government entitlements. The only thing I want is for my children to not be discriminated against. I want them to have equal access to all jobs, college enrollment, loans, contracts, scholarships, educational opportunities, and for them to be safe.

I assume you mean discriminated against because of their race. Discrimination is how the world gets categorized.

[C Darwin]

That, "The Color of Crime" article (the one he cited in a later post) has been floating around in white hate group circles for years. I suspected that's where he got the 90% figure. Turns out I was right.
Turns out you were wrong.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/chi-murders10jun10,1,5105213.story?coll=chi-newsnationworld-hed

[C Darwin]

I assume you mean discriminated against because of their race. Discrimination is how the world gets categorized.
Sure, but for any reason; gender, sexual preference, political affiliation, religion, whatever.

[nehemiah]

white pride, worldwide.

14 words, bitches.

ask mr. darwin what they are.

[Green Lantern]

Sure, but for any reason; gender, sexual preference, political affiliation, religion, whatever.

Civilization lives by its discriminations and rankings. It penalizes some human inclinations and rewards others. Gatekeepers of many kinds and at many levels push some and individuals forward hold others back. Civilization favors the wise and the virtuous, not the superficial and dissolute...as discussed, briefly above, it is the very essence of civilization NOT to give equal opportunity. A proponent of 'equality of opportunity' might object that all he opposes is arbitrary or illegitimate denial of opportunity, but that objection begs the all-important question of how to properly discriminate.

-Claes Ryn "America The Virtuous"

[ICRockets]

The term commonly used for your definition is a racialist. I do like to blog about racial issues from a viewpoint that has been forbidden by the MSM. My primary lens in which I view the world is the survivability of my children. I politic and try to gather support to end our Euro-American second-class citizenship under affirmative action rulings and minority government entitlements. The only thing I want is for my children to not be discriminated against. I want them to have equal access to all jobs, college enrollment, loans, contracts, scholarships, educational opportunities, and for them to be safe.

C Darwin: "I dream of a world where my white children get the privileges they are rightfully owed by being heir to the master race."

[Green Lantern]

The thought has never occurred to me to go and look up any race-based statistic.

I guess your focus DOES determine your reality.

[C Darwin]

Civilization lives by its discriminations and rankings. It penalizes some human inclinations and rewards others. Gatekeepers of many kinds and at many levels push some and individuals forward hold others back. Civilization favors the wise and the virtuous, not the superficial and dissolute...as discussed, briefly above, it is the very essence of civilization NOT to give equal opportunity. A proponent of 'equality of opportunity' might object that all he opposes is arbitrary or illegitimate denial of opportunity, but that objection begs the all-important question of how to properly discriminate.

-Claes Ryn "America The Virtuous"
Bull! I absolutely challenge this notion. This statement is so logically flawed, I fear the critique would consume too much of my time.

[Green Lantern]

Bull! I absolutely challenge this notion. This statement is so logically flawed, I fear the critique would consume too much of my time.

How you discriminate is how you make distinctions. You don't want certain types of discriminations but you do live well by others.

[gilchristfan]

Turns out you were wrong.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/chi-murders10jun10,1,5105213.story?coll=chi-newsnationworld-hed

You want to give me the capsulized version of it Chaz? Lost my password to the Trib and they haven't emailed me another one yet.

Out of curiousity, considering if you're white and murdered, your chances are about 85% that the killer will be another white person. Shouldn't that make me more nervous than the other 15%?

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

The term commonly used for your definition is a racialist. I do like to blog about racial issues from a viewpoint that has been forbidden by the MSM. My primary lens in which I view the world is the survivability of my children. I politic and try to gather support to end our Euro-American second-class citizenship under affirmative action rulings and minority government entitlements. The only thing I want is for my children to not be discriminated against. I want them to have equal access to all jobs, college enrollment, loans, contracts, scholarships, educational opportunities, and for them to be safe.

your paragraph is peppered with supremacist phrases - you've been reading a lot of that stuff I am sure.

So, just who is your avatar picture of?

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

What makes me a supremacist?

It's your choice, you tell us?

[gilchristfan]

white pride, worldwide.

14 words, bitches.

ask mr. darwin what they are.

Just don't ask him the 88 Precepts

BTW, David Lane just died in prison a few weeks ago.

Wonder if he's met up with Alan Berg on the other side yet?

[C Darwin]

How you discriminate is how you make distinctions. You don't want certain types of discriminations but you do live well by others.
Example?

[Green Lantern]

Example?

If medical schools did not discriminate in admissions based on scores on the MCAT's, you would not feel too good going to the doctor's office.

[nehemiah]

white "nationalists" are pussies. IPSO FACTO.

you should see them do their little fairy dances during their "retreats" in the woods of northeast PA.

:burp:

[nehemiah]

Bull! I absolutely challenge this notion. This statement is so logically flawed, I fear the critique would consume too much of my time.:rofl:

[C Darwin]

You want to give me the capsulized version of it Chaz? Lost my password to the Trib and they haven't emailed me another one yet.

Out of curiousity, considering if you're white and murdered, your chances are about 85% that the killer will be another white person. Shouldn't that make me more nervous than the other 15%?

I'm just talking about the 15%, if you want to talk about the 85%, start another thread.

[C Darwin]

If medical schools did not discriminate in admissions based on scores on the MCAT's, you would not feel too good going to the doctor's office.
But this is just as advantageous to me as it is to everyone else.

[Green Lantern]

But this is just as advantageous to me as it is to everyone else.

Exactly. Discrimination that you consider valid, just, or beneficial.

Just what Claes Ryn wrote.

[C Darwin]

It's your choice, you tell us?
I would have to say that I'm not a supremacist, and I can't understand why some people think that I am.

Avatar Link
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qqZ2csRhY7I&mode=related&search=

[ICRockets]

I would have to say that I'm not a supremacist, and I can't understand why some people think that I am.

Avatar Link
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qqZ2csRhY7I&mode=related&search=

Umm...crazy thought, but maybe it's your asinine "Waa waa waa white people like me have it so hard and the liberals don't want to admit it" tirades that are the basis of this thread?

Nah, that can't be it.

[Gibby]

The term commonly used for your definition is a racialist. I do like to blog about racial issues from a viewpoint that has been forbidden by the MSM. My primary lens in which I view the world is the survivability of my children. I politic and try to gather support to end our Euro-American second-class citizenship under affirmative action rulings and minority government entitlements. The only thing I want is for my children to not be discriminated against. I want them to have equal access to all jobs, college enrollment, loans, contracts, scholarships, educational opportunities, and for them to be safe.

David Duke just called and he wants his talking points back. Oh and my wife says what's your problem? Question chucky D am I a race traitor in your eyes?

[C Darwin]

Exactly. Discrimination that you consider valid, just, or beneficial.

Just what Claes Ryn wrote.

and this does not apply to AA.

[ICRockets]

David Duke just called and he wants his talking points back. Oh and my wife says what's your problem? Question chucky D am I a race traitor in your eyes?

From the sound of it, I think he'd prefer the term "****** lover", but I'm sure he's just using it to spite the "MSM" and not because it reflects his racist- or is it racialist?- behaviour/mentality.

[C Darwin]

David Duke just called and he wants his talking points back. Oh and my wife says what's your problem? Question chucky D am I a race traitor in your eyes?

No, just a douchebag for flaming me.

[Gibby]

No, just a douchebag for flaming me.

flaming you're the one who sounds like he could be the klan's featured spokesperson.

Does the phrase we hate Nig g ers, Jews, Spics make you say rock on. Sorry I just cannot stand racists or racialists. I mean really are we not all made in the image of God? God would not have made so many shades of humanity if He didn't love variety? Really who wants a bunch of pasty daisies?

[Green Lantern]

and this does not apply to AA.

I have never said it did.

We were on the subject of race and diverged into discrimination. Discrimination has some sort of negative connotation in your mind and you were opposed to the notion. The point I was making is that discrimination is a necessary part of life. Certain types of discrimination are considered, today, bad but others are considered good and beneficial.

That's all.

[C Darwin]

flaming you're the one who sounds like he could be the klan's featured spokesperson.

Does the phrase we hate Nig g ers, Jews, Spics make you say rock on. Sorry I just cannot stand racists or racialists. I mean really are we not all made in the image of God? God would not have made so many shades of humanity if He didn't love variety? Really who wants a bunch of pasty daisies?

Have I ever used those words? No. What hateful things have I posted? None. Only Ideas and thoughts. I don't hate anybody. Not even the posters who continually slander and flame me. I have a job, a family, friends, overall I'm a very likable guy. I just see the world in many different ways.

The white victim angle has always intrigued me because to take a pro euro-american stance, is considered by many of the sheeple to be racist. To me, that POV is a joke.

BTW, you are talking to an Roman Catholic agnostic. And as for the variety, Darwin says that not everyone is supposed to make it.

[C Darwin]

I have never said it did.

We were on the subject of race and diverged into discrimination. Discrimination has some sort of negative connotation in your mind and you were opposed to the notion. The point I was making is that discrimination is a necessary part of life. Certain types of discrimination are considered, today, bad but others are considered good and beneficial.

That's all.
Ok fine.

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

I would have to say that I'm not a supremacist, and I can't understand why some people think that I am.

Avatar Link
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qqZ2csRhY7I&mode=related&search=

Given to your obsession with race, the answer above, and the link to a white man winning a foot race, would it be unreasonable for me to have Hitler pop into my mind, watching Jesse Owens win? I can see why you can't understand.

[gilchristfan]

I'm just talking about the 15%, if you want to talk about the 85%, start another thread.

No, I don't think I will, not when you say things like this:


The FBI figures put the amount of crime committed by blacks against whites at about 3,000 murders a year and 15,000 rapes. This is quite a bit of human suffering inflicted on one race by another. These death tolls far exceed the Iraq war . Guilt riddled liberals will not comment on this.

Any police detective can tell you that one of the most crucial factors in a crime is “opportunity." In other words were “they” in that “place” at that “time.”

Ask yourself this: How many thousands of white people should die so that we can live in a forcibly desegregated society? The answer you give to that question will tell you everything you need to know about yourself. That question should also be asked every time someone is FORCED to wear the number 42 and treat it as a “wonderful” thing.

Those evil segregationists warned us about the problems that would occur if the social barriers that had kept whites and blacks apart were removed. More crime, violence, murder, a decaying social structure, the ruin of our institutions. Looking back those segregationists sound more like Nostradamus than the racist hillbillies that they were painted out to be by the MSM.

-You don't want to discuss the fact that racially motivated crimes are a very small percentage of crimes committed overall;

-You don't want to discuss the fact that a white murder victim is far more likely to have been murdered by a white person;

-You don't want to discuss the fact that if a black person kills someone, they are far more likely to kill another black person;

-You don't want to consider any other motivation for an interracial crime, (poverty, drug trafficing, gang wars, random killings, etc),

-Of the 3000 murders against whites you claim to occur, (still trying to figure out where you got that figure, Bureau of Justice statistics doesn't show more than 1,400 since 1976, and never reached 900 since 1998 see http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/homicide/tables/ovracetab.htm#numbers) you can't say how many are committed in whole, or part, due to race.

-In the article you used to start this thread, you ignore the fact that the article itself identifies the crime as a random carjacking.

But....

you know the cause is "forced desegregation".

Its a pretty standard tactic of the supremacy movement.

Take a single statistic, inflate it, isolate it, ignore its percentage overall, ignore every other possibility for the existence of that statistic;

but still draw a conclusion after all of this ignorance..., and that conclusion just happens to fit your agenda.

You wonder why people think you're a white supremacist? Stop using their talking points and stop using their MO and maybe they'll think different.

And then you say: "Guilt riddled liberals will not comment on this."

I just did, and I'm not really a liberal (well, except to Uppy and a few others).

And when I did, your comment was "I'm just talking about the 15%."

Who doesn't want to comment on it?

[C Darwin]

ad hominem -- Latin for "to the man," attacking the arguer and not the argument (e.g., The Reverend Dr. Smith is a known Biblical fundamentalist, so her objections to evolution need not be taken seriously)

[nehemiah]

lelelelelelelelelelelelelel

gilberto da silva ferreira just housed darwin.

great stuff... that was hilarious.

:rofl:

[pmoon6]

The FBI figures put the amount of crime committed by blacks against whites at about 3,000 murders a year and 15,000 rapes. This is quite a bit of human suffering inflicted on one race by another. These death tolls far exceed the Iraq war . Guilt riddled liberals will not comment on this.

Any police detective can tell you that one of the most crucial factors in a crime is “opportunity." In other words were “they” in that “place” at that “time.”

Ask yourself this: How many thousands of white people should die so that we can live in a forcibly desegregated society? The answer you give to that question will tell you everything you need to know about yourself. That question should also be asked every time someone is FORCED to wear the number 42 and treat it as a “wonderful” thing.

Those evil segregationists warned us about the problems that would occur if the social barriers that had kept whites and blacks apart were removed. More crime, violence, murder, a decaying social structure, the ruin of our institutions. Looking back those segregationists sound more like Nostradamus than the racist hillbillies that they were painted out to be by the MSM.

http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cache:4oSO5vnaa0oJ:www.amren.com/color.pdf+interracial+crime+statistics&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=5&gl=us&client=safariThis is rich.

The guy calls me a racist, a pussy and a coward because I hired a Hispanic over a Anglo and then he posts this.

I have been to a white supremacist/survivalist rally and know members of the Klan. You rhetoric sounds just like theirs except some of theirs is a little more hate filled.

I don't mind you discussing the subject, but how many people of color do we have on here that can give their side of the argument?

Most of the black guys I know or have worked with are too busy taking care of their families to worry about the bigger picture of race relations. We just take each other at face value, either you're a decent person or you're a ********.

I think you fall into the second catagory.

[gilchristfan]

ad hominem -- Latin for "to the man," attacking the arguer and not the argument (e.g., The Reverend Dr. Smith is a known Biblical fundamentalist, so her objections to evolution need not be taken seriously)


You must have missed these points (attacking your arguments)

-You don't want to discuss the fact that racially motivated crimes are a very small percentage of crimes committed overall;

-You don't want to discuss the fact that a white murder victim is far more likely to have been murdered by a white person;

-You don't want to discuss the fact that if a black person kills someone, they are far more likely to kill another black person;

-You don't want to consider any other motivation for an interracial crime, (poverty, drug trafficing, gang wars, random killings, etc),

-Of the 3000 murders against whites you claim to occur, (still trying to figure out where you got that figure, Bureau of Justice statistics doesn't show more than 1,400 since 1976, and never reached 900 since 1998 see http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/homicid...ab.htm#numbers (http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/homicide/tables/ovracetab.htm#numbers)) you can't say how many are committed in whole, or part, due to race.

-In the article you used to start this thread, you ignore the fact that the article itself identifies the crime as a random carjacking.

But....

you know the cause is "forced desegregation".

Want to address them or continue to play the victim?

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

ad hominem -- Latin for "to the man," attacking the arguer and not the argument (e.g., The Reverend Dr. Smith is a known Biblical fundamentalist, so her objections to evolution need not be taken seriously)

Calling out an ad hom, it is difficult to avoid the same.

You do know that even if a fallacy, it does not disprove anything said.

[Angus]

I think it is interesting how liberals avoid the issue of disproportionate charges of hate crime.

Typical, ignore the point made and just take a wild swing. I'll try again, the circumstances of a crime are always taken into account, why do you only object when the circumstance taken into account is racism and the like?

I don't understand how a charge can be disproportionate. A sentence can be disproportionate, ie, out of proportion with the crime. How is a charge disproportionate? I have heard of overcharging, ie, charging offenses which are not supported by the facts. Is that what you mean?

Is your point that racism should not be a circumstance that is considered when gauging the severity of a crime and, as a result, the sentence given?

[Angus]

The FBI figures put the amount of crime committed by blacks against whites at about 3,000 murders a year and 15,000 rapes. This is quite a bit of human suffering inflicted on one race by another. These death tolls far exceed the Iraq war . Guilt riddled liberals will not comment on this.

Any police detective can tell you that one of the most crucial factors in a crime is “opportunity." In other words were “they” in that “place” at that “time.”

Ask yourself this: How many thousands of white people should die so that we can live in a forcibly desegregated society? The answer you give to that question will tell you everything you need to know about yourself. That question should also be asked every time someone is FORCED to wear the number 42 and treat it as a “wonderful” thing.

Those evil segregationists warned us about the problems that would occur if the social barriers that had kept whites and blacks apart were removed. More crime, violence, murder, a decaying social structure, the ruin of our institutions. Looking back those segregationists sound more like Nostradamus than the racist hillbillies that they were painted out to be by the MSM.

http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cache:4oSO5vnaa0oJ:www.amren.com/color.pdf+interracial+crime+statistics&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=5&gl=us&client=safari


Wow. Where to start? Lets keep it simple and focus on these one at a time:

"...3,000 murders a year and 15,000 rapes. This is quite a bit of human suffering inflicted on one race [white] by another . [B]These death tolls far exceed the Iraq war ..."

O-kee-do-kee. We have lost 3,512 American soldiers in Iraq. Last I checked, 3,512 is larger than 3,000. The death toll in Iraq of all coalition forces is 3,789. Again, in the world of us guilt ridden liberals, the number 3,789 is significantly larger than 3,000. Lets add in another 114,243 wounded medical evacuations for a total of 118,032 casualties in Iraq vs. 3,000 domestic murder cases. So, 3,000 "far exceeds" the deaths in Iraq?

Given that they are not whitefolk, I don't suppose you count the Iraqi dead but just for the sake of accuracy for those of us not dreaming of wearing night shirts and pointy hats, a minimum of 65,116 Iraqis have been killed in the war. Lets not forget the approximate 127 journalists killed there as well though I must confess, a lot of them might not have been white but being the guilt ridden liberal that I am, I am going to include them just the same upping our number to 183,275 dead or wounded people in the Iraq war. Whoops, I forgot the contractors there, of whom approximately 398 have been killed bringing the misery count in Iraq up to 183,673. I haven't been able to find stats on rape in Iraq over the last 4 years but adding them at this point would just be overkill, you are already so demonstrably wrong that further evidence is not needed.

Okay, back to your post in which you claim that 15,000 far exceeds 183,673.
Please explain how you could make an error that big? I showed your post to a friend of mine and he figured the only choices were that you were an idiot, a liar or both but I defended you, "lets hear his explanation first" I said.

Answer the question.

[C Darwin]

This is what needs to be explained to me.

How does interracial crime occur if races are segregated?

[ICRockets]

This is what needs to be explained to me.

How does interracial crime occur if races are segregated?

If you simultaneously believe that segregation is necessary and that you aren't a racist, then there is really quite a bit that needs to be explained to you.

Eat shit, bigot.

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

This is what needs to be explained to me.

How does interracial crime occur if races are segregated?

I'd hate to see your plan to eliminate homosexuality, rape, intraracial crime.

[ICRockets]

I'd hate to see your plan to eliminate homosexuality, rape, intraracial crime.

That's easy:

Homosexuality: Separate the straights from the queers.

Rape: Separate the men from the women.

Intraracial Crime: If you're such an ******* that your own people turn against you, you probably deserved it.

Then we'll re-district every state so there are only 9 counties: Black Gays, Black Lesbians, Black Dudes, Black Chicks, White Gays, White Lesbians, White Dudes, White Chicks (which we'll have to keep as far away from Black Dude County as possible), and Chinkspic.

The irony, of course, is that this is a disaster for any Republican candidate, as they have no chance of winning any counties but the White Straights.

[Green Lantern]

This is what needs to be explained to me.

How does interracial crime occur if races are segregated?

I think you could check the stats on S. Africa online if you were truly interested.

[C Darwin]

I’ll assume that everyone agrees that interracial crime would not occur if the races were segregated. I’m glad we all can all come together and agree on some things ; ) . So now we have integration. How much responsibility does this policy bear for all the lives lost and human suffering (both black and white)?

[gilchristfan]

I’ll assume that everyone agrees that birth defects would not occur if there were no births. I’m glad we all can all come together and agree on some things ; ) .

So now we have births. How much responsibility does this policy bear for all the lives lost and human suffering (both children and adults)?

[mighty peace warrior]

Maybe this will help, if you're really just wondering.

http://www.tolerance.org/news/article_hate.jsp?id=497

An article written a few years ago from the Southern Poverty Law Center. Its discussing the article that you obtained your information from.

A few highlights:

Mistaking Poverty for Race
But Taylor is plainly, demonstrably wrong. Taylor uses an incredibly simplistic analytical method that flatly ignores the fundamental conclusion of decades of serious criminology: Crime is intimately related to poverty.
In fact, when multivariate statistical methods such as regression analysis are used, study after study has shown that race has little, if any, predictive power.
This basic fact is so well understood among scholars of criminal justice that the preface to Minnesota's official crime data reports carries this caveat: "Racial and ethnic data must be treated with caution. … Existing research on crime has generally shown that racial or ethnic identity is not predictive of criminal behavior with data which has been controlled for social and economic factors."
When more sophisticated methodology is employed, socioeconomic factors including poverty, education, social status and urban residence account far better for criminal behavior than race. Above all, income counts.
It is precisely because being black in America is closely correlated with being poor, suffering from high unemployment and having low levels of education that the black community has relatively high crime rates. For example, In 1994, the same year that Taylor's data comes from, the poverty rate among blacks was three times that of whites. In addition, nearly 40% of black children grew up in poverty.
So while it is true, for instance, that blacks rob whites far more than vice versa, that is hardly a surprise -- whites, after all, own nearly 10 times the wealth that blacks do on average. They also own far more businesses.


...

What Taylor actually does is consider only a subset of data on crime -- statistics on interracial crimes between blacks and whites from the National Crime Victimization Survey (NCVS). For crimes of violence -- the crimes Taylor focuses on -- that data covers just 16% of the crimes committed in 1994. The result is a skewed view of the impact of race on crime that suggests that whites ought to be terrified of blacks who, in Taylor's view, present a serious threat to society
...


...
But this analysis completely overlooks the larger -- and far more scientifically defensible -- pattern in the data: Most crime is intraracial (black-on-black and white-on-white), not interracial. In fact, the NCVS data show that 73% of white violent crime victims were attacked by whites, and 80% of black victims were targeted by blacks. This pattern is even clearer in the category of murder. According to a 1997 government report, 94% of black murder victims, as well as 85% of white murder victims, were slain by members of their own race.
Thus, the larger reality, that danger comes mainly from one's own race, is utterly ignored by Taylor, who for reasons of his own is interested only in interracial crime....



....

First, Taylor excludes hate crimes based on religion, sexual orientation and disability. Then, using the remaining motivation categories of race and ethnicity, he says that 63% of these crimes were committed by whites, less than their 72% proportion of the population would suggest; and 19% were the work of blacks, even though blacks account for only 12% of Americans. Thus, Taylor concludes, blacks are more likely to commit hate crimes while whites are less so.
These numbers are deceptive. If one looks at all hate crimes and all ethnic groups, the data show that whites are responsible for 75% of all hate crimes -- higher than their proportion in the population -- while the black rate remains at 19%. Corrected for population, these numbers mean that blacks are 1.37 times more likely to commit hate crimes than all other races combined -- a far cry from the 1.99 rate that Taylor advances.
...

this would seem pretty accurate IMO. Economics has way more to do with crime rates than race

[ICRockets]

this would seem pretty accurate IMO. Economics has way more to do with crime rates than race

Darwin, I think we can trust the cop on this one, right? Or is this "ad hominem" because you don't feel like responding to things that make you look wrong?

[mighty peace warrior]

Avatar Link
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qqZ2csRhY7I&mode=related&search=

a white guy winning a sprinting race...holy crap

[ICRockets]

I’ll assume that everyone agrees that interracial crime would not occur if the races were segregated. I’m glad we all can all come together and agree on some things ; ) . So now we have integration. How much responsibility does this policy bear for all the lives lost and human suffering (both black and white)?

That's like assuming there would be no abortions if we made them illegal, or that homosexuals only love eachother in the state of Massachusetts.

[C Darwin]

I’ll assume that everyone agrees that birth defects would not occur if there were no births. I’m glad we all can all come together and agree on some things ; ) .

So now we have births. How much responsibility does this policy bear for all the lives lost and human suffering (both children and adults)?

Oh, now I see. Nobody has a choice to give birth or not to give birth, and integration is voluntary. Good point sparky.

[dilbert]

I think some blacks moved into my pearly white neighborhood.

Should I be scared????

[Green Lantern]

Oh, now I see. Nobody has a choice to give birth or not to give birth, and integration is voluntary. Good point sparky.

Keep fighting. Don't let them get you down.

[C Darwin]

this would seem pretty accurate IMO. Economics has way more to do with crime rates than race

Food for thought.

http://www.jabpage.org/features/racestat/racestat11.html

[Angus]

This is what needs to be explained to me.

How does interracial crime occur if races are segregated?

During segregation, blacks rode in the back of the bus and whites in the front, they were still on the same bus, duh. Thus crime between them was possible. Care to count all the men tortured to death during lynchings back in the good old days of segregation?

This needs to be explained to me:

If you want to completely separate people by their race, how do you define each race? How black do you need to be to be tossed across the fence? How much white do you need in your line of descent to be qualify for the white section? Are we going to split up only based on color? Is that the only racial characteristic that matters? What do we do with albino africans?

All this biogtry hidden beneath a thin veneer of pseudo intellectual fractured logic and half-thoughts, all because of the amount of melanin in ones skin.

[Gibby]

This is what needs to be explained to me.

How does interracial crime occur if races are segregated?

**** you!

Seriously are you like Guvnah Wallace or something.

[Gibby]

During segregation, blacks rode in the back of the bus and whites in the front, they were still on the same bus, duh. Thus crime between them was possible. Care to count all the men tortured to death during lynchings back in the good old days of segregation?

This needs to be explained to me:

If you want to completely separate people by their race, how do you define each race? How black do you need to be to be tossed across the fence? How much white do you need in your line of descent to be qualify for the white section? Are we going to split up only based on color? Is that the only racial characteristic that matters? What do we do with albino africans?

All this biogtry hidden beneath a thin veneer of pseudo intellectual fractured logic and half-thoughts, all because of the amount of melanin in ones skin.

Chucky D isn't going to respond.

[Gibby]

Food for thought.

http://www.jabpage.org/features/racestat/racestat11.html

you promised me food for thought, my brain is starving to death. Jerry's Aryan battle page? Really?

Is Jerry Iranian? The reason I ask is that no white man is an "Aryan" and in fact only the Persians have that claim, this is from Olmstead's History of the Persian Empire (he is a credible source, your website is a piece of sludge).

Tell you what ubersturmbahnfuehrer, you find me a credible source to support your claim and I will have a look at it. Your Jerry's Iranian battle site is as bogus as they come. Hell, I'll even tell you what a credible source

1) Mainstream news sources such as Reuters, AP, C-SPAN, FOXNews, BBC, ABC, CBC, NBC, CBS, PBS, Wall Street Journal, etc

2) Peer reviewed journals dealing with all manner of things from Philosophy, Religion, English, History, Politics, Art, Music, and Education etc.

3) Websites ending in .gov or .edu

4) Emails from experts who are leaders in their field as long as they talk about credentials

5) primary sources and government lithographs

The following is a list of things that are not credible sources

1) stormfront.org, jerrysaryanbattlepage.com and almost all non government or education websites

2) blog entries

3) random posts on message boards

4) info that is not from mainstream sources and not able to be verified by main stream sources

5) email from your buddies

Until you find me a credible source, and your source is far from credible, you can take your racist -oh sorry racialist bullshit- and shove it up your ass.

[Gibby]

and for my money you can go to hell because you are nothing but a worthless piece of sewage.

[Green Lantern]

and for my money you can go to hell because you are nothing but a worthless piece of sewage.

C'mon dude.

What do you care what this guy thinks? You'll probably never meet him and, after all, this is America.

[C Darwin]

During segregation, blacks rode in the back of the bus and whites in the front, they were still on the same bus, duh. Thus crime between them was possible. Care to count all the men tortured to death during lynchings back in the good old days of segregation?

This needs to be explained to me:

If you want to completely separate people by their race, how do you define each race? How black do you need to be to be tossed across the fence? How much white do you need in your line of descent to be qualify for the white section? Are we going to split up only based on color? Is that the only racial characteristic that matters? What do we do with albino africans?

All this biogtry hidden beneath a thin veneer of pseudo intellectual fractured logic and half-thoughts, all because of the amount of melanin in ones skin.

There were roughly 80 lynching / year in the US during times of segregation. These lynching represented breakdowns in the segregation policy. Black were lynched for crossing the lines that were set by society, rarely were they naked acts of aggression.

Before everyone tries to deflect the issue, I am not defending the acts of these murderers. I’m just pointing out what happens when social lines are crossed. It happens still today. For the government to force the issue causes people to die.

[Green Lantern]

There were roughly 80 lynching / year in the US during times of segregation. These lynching represented breakdowns in the segregation policy. Black were lynched for crossing the lines that were set by society, rarely were they naked acts of aggression.

Before everyone tries to deflect the issue, I am not defending the acts of these murderers. I’m just pointing out what happens when social lines are crossed. It happens still today. For the government to force the issue causes people to die.

"It is God's affair altogether.

Did not the believers know that, if God had willed, He would have guided men all together? And still the unbelievers are smitten by a shattering for what they wrought, or it alights nigh their habitation, until God's promise comes; and God will not fail the tryst. Messengers indeed were scoffed at before thee, and I respited the unbelievers; then I seized them--and how was my retribution?"

-The Koran

[C Darwin]

and for my money you can go to hell because you are nothing but a worthless piece of sewage.

got self-righteousness?

[pmoon6]

and for my money you can go to hell because you are nothing but a worthless piece of sewage.Ahhhhh, I got someone that's lower on the Gibby scale than me.

Worthless piece of sewage is down a notch from worthless piece of shit.

I could probably get myself lower on the scale, but that would involve really nasty insults.

I'll try.

[ICRockets]

There were roughly 80 lynching / year in the US during times of segregation. These lynching represented breakdowns in the segregation policy. Black were lynched for crossing the lines that were set by society, rarely were they naked acts of aggression.

Before everyone tries to deflect the issue, I am not defending the acts of these murderers. I’m just pointing out what happens when social lines are crossed. It happens still today. For the government to force the issue causes people to die.

See, nehe? It's like I said. Racism is only a problem when whites are being wronged.

[nehemiah]

Food for thought.

http://www.jabpage.org/features/racestat/racestat11.html:rofl:

"Jerry's Racial Violence Statistics Page"?

[Green Lantern]

Ahhhhh, I got someone that's lower on the Gibby scale than me.

Worthless piece of sewage is down a notch from worthless piece of shit.

I could probably get myself lower on the scale, but that would involve really nasty insults.


That's just wrong.

[nehemiah]

seriously, moonie.

that's out of bounds.

[gilchristfan]

Ahhhhh, I got someone that's lower on the Gibby scale than me.

Worthless piece of sewage is down a notch from worthless piece of shit.

I could probably get myself lower on the scale, but that would involve really nasty insults.

I'll try.

seriously, moonie.

that's out of bounds.

?? Its out of bounds for Moonie to say there's someone lower than him on the Gibby scale?

He's doomed to Gibby scale pariah status?

Every man should have the right to pull themselves up on the Gibby scale. Its the American thing to do.

[Green Lantern]

It was edited. You missed out. The worst family smack.

[nehemiah]

?? Its out of bounds for Moonie to say there's someone lower than him on the Gibby scale?i edited a bunch of crap out of the post and the quoted part in aqua's post.

[Gibby]

There were roughly 80 lynching / year in the US during times of segregation. These lynching represented breakdowns in the segregation policy. Black were lynched for crossing the lines that were set by society, rarely were they naked acts of aggression.

Before everyone tries to deflect the issue, I am not defending the acts of these murderers. I’m just pointing out what happens when social lines are crossed. It happens still today. For the government to force the issue causes people to die.

Damn how dare dem darkies try to cross lines and do things like well vote and expect to get a decent job. Uppity negroes, tell you what and hell its not like the 13th through 15th amendments mean nothing.

[Gibby]

Ahhhhh, I got someone that's lower on the Gibby scale than me.

Worthless piece of sewage is down a notch from worthless piece of shit.

I could probably get myself lower on the scale, but that would involve really nasty insults.

I'll try.
I find you rehinsable in somethings, but all in all I find you to be a hard working person who actually has done something to help his fellow man. Yeah I might call you a goddamned jackass but I mean it with all due respect.

[Gibby]

got self-righteousness?

have a brain?

[Gibby]

Ahhhhh, I got someone that's lower on the Gibby scale than me.

Worthless piece of sewage is down a notch from worthless piece of shit.

I could probably get myself lower on the scale, but that would involve really nasty insults.

I'll try.

please don't and the gibby scale, sorry but that gets a thanks.

[mighty peace warrior]

Food for thought.

http://www.jabpage.org/features/racestat/racestat11.html

that doesnt really refute the argument. all americans are a tad more violent than they used to be(or at least they call the police more often when they are).

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

I can't wait for the day when people of color rule America, as they initially did. Only then will my white guilt subside!

No more guilt!

No more guilt!

We's sorry!

[gilchristfan]

It was edited. You missed out. The worst family smack.

too bad. a dollop of family smack is great for cleaning the palate after a heavy first course of segregationist propoganda.

[gilchristfan]

Oh, now I see. Nobody has a choice to give birth or not to give birth, and integration is voluntary. Good point sparky.

Kevin, Kevin, Kevin. Missed the point again, I guess.

I suppose I could point out to you why your little plan of desegregation to end interracial violence won't work.

I could point out that unlike those who recently emerged from a time capsule in Jim Crowsville, there are lots and lots of people in this country who get along just find with people of another race, or another religion, or another ethnic group. Neighbors, co-workers, friends, and yes, even spouses (gasp!).

For you to carry out your master plan, you'll need to use forcible means to desegregate blacks and whites. It won't be voluntary.

I could point that out, but it won't matter, its not like you're here to debate, you've ignored too many people's legitimate questions for me to believe that.

Its easier just to lighten it up a bit. Your thread reminded me of an article I read a while back. You've got to be "Kevin".. Enjoy. And careful who you invite to Applebee's.

http://www.sfweekly.com/2005-02-23/news/my-dinner-at-applebee-s-with-white-supremacists/

My Dinner at Applebee's With White Supremacists!


I decide to infiltrate a white supremacist hate group by posing as an eager new recruit, a new hater, if you will. I want to put a face on extreme hate, to find out the hobbies of haters, what haters find hot and what haters find not. I want to learn what someone in a hate group really loooooooves. Ice cream? Everyone loves ice cream. I love ice cream. Maybe hate groups love ice cream, too?

So Many Hate Groups, So Little Time
I go online, trolling for hate groups. Who knew there was so much organized hate around? Which one to choose? Why, there's the Aryan Nation, the World Church of the Creator, and the National Socialist Movement, not to mention the White Aryan Resistance, the White Power Liberation Front, and, of course, the kooky and lovable Ku Klux Klan.
After sending out many e-mails under the pseudonym of hater-to-be Hal Haterman, I find my hate group. And believe me, it's a good one! Its Web site rails on about "the Negroid filth churned out by MTV and the other Jewish promoters of anti-White music intended to demoralize, corrupt, and deracinate young Whites." My, someone's panties are certainly in a bundle.

[pmoon6]

seriously, moonie.

that's out of bounds.You're right. My apologies to the board.

My psychiatrist recently cut me loose, she said she couldn't help me anymore.

Something about enabling a sociopath.

[dilbert]

Great article Gil!

[TRIPLE P]

This thread rocks. One guy justifying his hate, without answering any of the questions posed.

So basically this is one guy posting his bigoted thoughts....its a soapbox for racism.

Well hey, at least everyone knows that the OG poster is a racist peice of crap and will treat him as such in every thread he posts in.

Congrats Darwin...you've ruined any reputation you have here....

[Gibby]

This thread rocks. One guy justifying his hate, without answering any of the questions posed.

So basically this is one guy posting his bigoted thoughts....its a soapbox for racism.

Well hey, at least everyone knows that the OG poster is a racist peice of crap and will treat him as such in every thread he posts in.

Congrats Darwin...you've ruined any reputation you have here....

exactly

[Gibby]

chucky D I really should not do this, but I no longer care about TOS when it comes to you as you would be no real loss. So next time you get an itch to post go here instead:

http://www.stormfront.org

You'd fit right in, we don't need you so buh-bye

[C Darwin]

Such assumptions regarding my motives, my my. The prejudging of my intentions is so disappointing. The anger and hatred towards me is undisguised, and yet I am the one who is being labeled a racist, hate monger, and all the rest that goes along with having an independent thought regarding race relations. This thread is a perfect example of the verbal abuse that is acceptable towards people that don’t believe that being black is a condition worthy of charity. I have seen and read through the Stormfront website. I am not a member of this website due to the closed minded nature of the members and the abusive language that is used towards non-Europeans. It reminds me of the hostility directed towards me on this thread. However, I am a member of Blackplanet. The members there can be equally as racist and I enjoy giving those people as much $h!+ as possible.

As for not addressing everybody’s questions, I don’t see how many of the questions pertain to my point (which I have not made yet). I started the thread and I don’t feel obligated to address questions which IMO, deflect the focus of the conversation. If you really want to know my opinion on an issue, PM me, I’ll be sure to get back to you.

I think we can all agree that to reinstate segregation would be impossible. I’m sure my critics are disappointed that their prejudices regarding my motives are false.

So on with the discussion…

1. Whites bear the brunt of interracial crime
2. Nobody has posted a convincing argument that integration has nothing to do with interracial violence levels.
3. If there was a policy of choice, rather than integration, how many lives could have been saved?

[Gibby]

You're right. My apologies to the board.

My psychiatrist recently cut me loose, she said she couldn't help me anymore.

Something about enabling a sociopath.

I could believe it. :guy:

But hey you confess to having a problem, now the treatment can begin. j/k

[Gibby]

So on with the discussion…

1. Whites bear the brunt of interracial crime
2. Nobody has posted a convincing argument that integration has nothing to do with interracial violence levels.
3. If there was a policy of choice, rather than integration, how many lives could have been saved?

1) Evidence please, and I don't mean from bullshit websites where tiny brained induhviduals go on rants. No check what I call a credible source and show me evidence.

2) You have not yet posted a convincing argument that integration has anything to do with interracial violence levels

3) Probably not that many and this nation would have seen a terrible series of lynchings to shut up those uppity negroes all across the south.

[ICRockets]

Such assumptions regarding my motives, my my. The prejudging of my intentions is so disappointing. The anger and hatred towards me is undisguised, and yet I am the one who is being labeled a racist, hate monger, and all the rest that goes along with having an independent thought regarding race relations. This thread is a perfect example of the verbal abuse that is acceptable towards people that don’t believe that being black is a condition worthy of charity. I have seen and read through the Stormfront website. I am not a member of this website due to the closed minded nature of the members and the abusive language that is used towards non-Europeans. It reminds me of the hostility directed towards me on this thread. However, I am a member of Blackplanet. The members there can be equally as racist and I enjoy giving those people as much $h!+ as possible.
As for not addressing everybody’s questions, I don’t see how many of the questions pertain to my point (which I have not made yet). I started the thread and I don’t feel obligated to address questions which IMO, deflect the focus of the conversation. If you really want to know my opinion on an issue, PM me, I’ll be sure to get back to you.

I think we can all agree that to reinstate segregation would be impossible. I’m sure my critics are disappointed that their prejudices regarding my motives are false.

So on with the discussion…

1. Whites bear the brunt of interracial crime
2. Nobody has posted a convincing argument that integration has nothing to do with interracial violence levels.
3. If there was a policy of choice, rather than integration, how many lives could have been saved?

So...white people spew racism and you say "I'm not gonna get involved with that", but if black people spew racism you decide it's ok for you to flame them to your heart's content?

Who's the one with the double standard, again?

[Gibby]

So...white people spew racism and you say "I'm not gonna get involved with that", but if black people spew racism you decide it's ok for you to flame them to your heart's content?

Who's the one with the double standard, again?

not him, double standard is a four syllable phrase, and he wouldn't be able to understand.

[C Darwin]

So...white people spew racism and you say "I'm not gonna get involved with that", but if black people spew racism you decide it's ok for you to flame them to your heart's content?

Who's the one with the double standard, again?

I concede to that double standard. Flaming the people on blackplanet is just too much fun.

[Gibby]

I concede to that double standard. Flaming the people on blackplanet is just too much fun.

I know what you mean, why do you think I pick on you. :D

[Green Lantern]

I know what you mean, why do you think I pick on you. :D

Touche!

[Gibby]

and I don't mean to trash your hero, well I do, but this always cracks me up

<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/P_D7WtOHZd0"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/P_D7WtOHZd0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"></embed></object>

[pmoon6]

I know what you mean, why do you think I pick on you. :DYou pick on everbody, you brute.

My psyche will never be the same.

[Gibby]

You pick on everbody, you brute.

My psyche will never be the same.

why moon you are rising on the gibby scale, I now have you as ass. :D

[Gibby]

You pick on everbody, you brute.

My psyche will never be the same.

well yes, I do have issues don't I. My last therapist tried, she really did, but she eventually ended up killing herself. :D

[C Darwin]

I know what you mean, why do you think I pick on you. :D
D'oh! Didn’t see it coming. Anyway, are we all still avoiding the focus of the discussion?

[Gibby]

D'oh! Didn’t see it coming. Anyway, are we all still avoiding the focus of the discussion?

Not at all, I addressed the issue

Such assumptions regarding my motives, my my. The prejudging of my intentions is so disappointing. The anger and hatred towards me is undisguised, and yet I am the one who is being labeled a racist, hate monger, and all the rest that goes along with having an independent thought regarding race relations. This thread is a perfect example of the verbal abuse that is acceptable towards people that don’t believe that being black is a condition worthy of charity. I have seen and read through the Stormfront website. I am not a member of this website due to the closed minded nature of the members and the abusive language that is used towards non-Europeans. It reminds me of the hostility directed towards me on this thread. However, I am a member of Blackplanet. The members there can be equally as racist and I enjoy giving those people as much $h!+ as possible.

As for not addressing everybody’s questions, I don’t see how many of the questions pertain to my point (which I have not made yet). I started the thread and I don’t feel obligated to address questions which IMO, deflect the focus of the conversation. If you really want to know my opinion on an issue, PM me, I’ll be sure to get back to you.

I think we can all agree that to reinstate segregation would be impossible. I’m sure my critics are disappointed that their prejudices regarding my motives are false.

So on with the discussion…

1. Whites bear the brunt of interracial crime
2. Nobody has posted a convincing argument that integration has nothing to do with interracial violence levels.
3. If there was a policy of choice, rather than integration, how many lives could have been saved?

The Bold is the discussion isn't it?

1) Evidence please, and I don't mean from bullshit websites where tiny brained induhviduals go on rants. No check what I call a credible source and show me evidence.

2) You have not yet posted a convincing argument that integration has anything to do with interracial violence levels

3) Probably not that many and this nation would have seen a terrible series of lynchings to shut up those uppity negroes all across the south.

The above is how I addressed the issues you broached.

[gilchristfan]

Such assumptions regarding my motives, my my. The prejudging of my intentions is so disappointing. The anger and hatred towards me is undisguised, and yet I am the one who is being labeled a racist, hate monger, and all the rest that goes along with having an independent thought regarding race relations. This thread is a perfect example of the verbal abuse that is acceptable towards people that don’t believe that being black is a condition worthy of charity. I have seen and read through the Stormfront website. I am not a member of this website due to the closed minded nature of the members and the abusive language that is used towards non-Europeans. It reminds me of the hostility directed towards me on this thread. However, I am a member of Blackplanet. The members there can be equally as racist and I enjoy giving those people as much $h!+ as possible.

As for not addressing everybody’s questions, I don’t see how many of the questions pertain to my point (which I have not made yet). I started the thread and I don’t feel obligated to address questions which IMO, deflect the focus of the conversation. If you really want to know my opinion on an issue, PM me, I’ll be sure to get back to you.

I think we can all agree that to reinstate segregation would be impossible. I’m sure my critics are disappointed that their prejudices regarding my motives are false.

So on with the discussion…

1. Whites bear the brunt of interracial crime
2. Nobody has posted a convincing argument that integration has nothing to do with interracial violence levels.
3. If there was a policy of choice, rather than integration, how many lives could have been saved?

The melodramatics;
The pseudo intellectualism;
The victimization;
The whacko ideas;
The overabundance of self-pity;

It can only mean one thing:

StraightJ Returns

http://assets.buffalobills.com/images/content/billy200x300.jpg

And this time....its racial!

3 1/2 years after being ditched by Hurls in a bathroom at the Ralph, Straightj makes his triumphal return to the PRS. Engulfing the intricacies of zen bigotry during his hiatus, the self appointed master intends to enlighten the forum with his new/old dogma.

Will the second verse be the same as the first?


http://www.blankvideotape.com/rated-R.gif

There probably won't be too many that remember him. Shiva, Dilbert, Meathead, maybe Moonie, a few others perhaps. It was a trip.

[Gibby]

I vaguely remember him and yet I don't want to.

[mighty peace warrior]

The melodramatics;
The pseudo intellectualism;
The victimization;
The whacko ideas;
The overabundance of self-pity;

It can only mean one thing:

StraightJ Returns

http://assets.buffalobills.com/images/content/billy200x300.jpg

And this time....its racial!

3 1/2 years after being ditched by Hurls in a bathroom at the Ralph, Straightj makes his triumphal return to the PRS. Engulfing the intricacies of zen bigotry during his hiatus, the self appointed master intends to enlighten the forum with his new/old dogma.

Will the second verse be the same as the first?


http://www.blankvideotape.com/rated-R.gif

There probably won't be too many that remember him. Shiva, Dilbert, Meathead, maybe Moonie, a few others perhaps. It was a trip.





that was awesome...

[dilbert]

StraightJ ruled!!!!!!!!!

I nominate mpw to take him to a Bills game this time. It is his turn.

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

So on with the discussion…

1. Whites bear the brunt of interracial crime
2. Nobody has posted a convincing argument that integration has nothing to do with interracial violence levels.
3. If there was a policy of choice, rather than integration, how many lives could have been saved?

1.) But not because they are white, UNLESS YOU HAVE PROOF.
2.) It has everything to do with it. As a matter of fact, the larger part of crime where whites are victims of other whites, results from allowing whites to intermingle. BUT DO YOU CARE? NO.
3.) Actually the greater loss is due to my explanation in No. 2, above. BUT DO YOU CARE? NO.

By the way, you are a stoopy.

[C Darwin]

All right gentlemen, much better job staying with the gist of the conversation. Again, my information comes from the Chicago Tribune article that linked in the first post on this thread. I know I’m getting to some people because they’re asking divergent questions and speculating my response. Low class, but it makes me laugh. Next, many of your arguments are an appeal to ignorance claiming that whatever has not been proven to be true, must be false. In other words, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

This is a busy time of year foe me so I think now is the time to make my final point. Regarding point three, if there was a policy of choice, rather than integration, how many lives could have been saved? One poster replied “not many”. Ok, so my final question is this. How many people should die so that we can live in a forcibly desegregated society?

Ultimately this is an issue of choice, freedom, forming a more perfect union, establishing justice, insuring domestic tranquility, providing for the common defense, promoting the general welfare, and securing the blessings of liberty to ourselves and to our children. This doesn't even have to be about race.

PS: I always thought the use of the term pseudo-intellectual was kind of pseudo-intellectual.

[ICRockets]

All right gentlemen, much better job staying with the gist of the conversation. Again, my information comes from the Chicago Tribune article that linked in the first post on this thread. I know I’m getting to some people because they’re asking divergent questions and speculating my response. Low class, but it makes me laugh. Next, many of your arguments are an appeal to ignorance claiming that whatever has not been proven to be true, must be false. In other words, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

This is a busy time of year foe me so I think now is the time to make my final point. Regarding point three, if there was a policy of choice, rather than integration, how many lives could have been saved? One poster replied “not many”. Ok, so my final question is this. How many people should die so that we can live in a forcibly desegregated society?

Ultimately this is an issue of choice, freedom, forming a more perfect union, establishing justice, insuring domestic tranquility, providing for the common defense, promoting the general welfare, and securing the blessings of liberty to ourselves and to our children. This doesn't even have to be about race.

PS: I always thought the use of the term pseudo-intellectual was kind of pseudo-intellectual.

I agree that this is an issue of choice and freedom. By segregating a society, you are inherently limiting somebody's choices of housing, schooling, work, etc. Where's the freedom in that? What you're talking about with your anti-desegregation is not at all about freedom, or choice, or domestic tranquility. You're talking about convenience. It would be convenient for you to live in the society you're promoting, and nothing more. You'd be putting your own right to convenience above somebody else's right to choose. That's the issue that you seem to not understand.

[mighty peace warrior]

StraightJ ruled!!!!!!!!!

I nominate mpw to take him to a Bills game this time. It is his turn.

better straight J than many that are still here, at least he didnt try to hide his crazy

[Shama-Lama Ding Dong]

All right gentlemen, much better job staying with the gist of the conversation. Again, my information comes from the Chicago Tribune article that linked in the first post on this thread. I know I’m getting to some people because they’re asking divergent questions and speculating my response. Low class, but it makes me laugh. Next, many of your arguments are an appeal to ignorance claiming that whatever has not been proven to be true, must be false. In other words, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
Not at all. You have moved from stating a statistic on interracial crime to promoting segregation as a solution to limiting that statistic, from which reasonably we can infer you believe interracial crime to occur due to race. Else why suggest something that only separates humans based on race and claim that it is life saving? You have not supported that. I don't need to point out the fallacy.


This is a busy time of year foe me so I think now is the time to make my final point. Regarding point three, if there was a policy of choice, rather than integration, how many lives could have been saved? One poster replied “not many”. Ok, so my final question is this. How many people should die so that we can live in a forcibly desegregated society?

I can think of one. But I think your question betrays an assumed cause of crime basis that you have not supported. Perhaps there could be more white deaths in a forcibly segregated society. If this is not possible, you can show us that. If you can't, then we can't argue that there is a number that should die.



Ultimately this is an issue of choice, freedom, forming a more perfect union, establishing justice, insuring domestic tranquility, providing for the common defense, promoting the general welfare, and securing the blessings of liberty to ourselves and to our children. This doesn't even have to be about race.
So why is it?

[TigerJ]

Hate crime: hurting the wrong person.

[Green Lantern]

This thread is a hate crime.

[ICRockets]

Trey, would you like to come here and maybe, I don't know, explain why you've groaned my post?

[ICRockets]

Still waiting, Trey...

[nehemiah]

we're down the rabbit hole, folks.

[Gibby]

we're down the rabbit hole, folks.

:rofl: can I use the kitten pic from time to time?

[nehemiah]

have at it.

i'm an open source kitties type of guy.

[Angus]

There were roughly 80 lynching / year in the US during times of segregation. These lynching represented breakdowns in the segregation policy. Black were lynched for crossing the lines that were set by society, rarely were they naked acts of aggression.

Before everyone tries to deflect the issue, I am not defending the acts of these murderers. I’m just pointing out what happens when social lines are crossed. It happens still today. For the government to force the issue causes people to die.

When white supremecists in Wilmington North Carolina took over the elected city government (lead by a white republican mayor) by force in 1898 and then murdered 38 black Americans, what "line set by society" had they crossed? Voting? Which society had set these "lines"?

Even worse massacres at Rosewood, in Tulsa and East St. Louis beg the same questions. Why do you assume that all those lynchings were the fault of blacks crossing social "lines"? Riddle me this Strom, do you think whites never crossed such lines in such ways as, oh, I don't know, raping a maid?

[Gibby]

When white supremecists in Wilmington North Carolina took over the elected city government (lead by a white republican mayor) by force in 1898 and then murdered 38 black Americans, what "line set by society" had they crossed? Voting? Which society had set these "lines"?

Even worse massacres at Rosewood, in Tulsa and East St. Louis beg the same questions. Why do you assume that all those lynchings were the fault of blacks crossing social "lines"? Riddle me this Strom, do you think whites never crossed such lines in such ways as, oh, I don't know, raping a maid?

Angus, tell me Rosewood is that where some whites dropped bombs from WWI biplanes or am I thinking of something else?

[Angus]

Angus, tell me Rosewood is that where some whites dropped bombs from WWI biplanes or am I thinking of something else?

I don't think so, it was in Florida in January of 1923. A white woman named Fannie Taylor was beaten, not raped, by a white man. To protect the guy, she claimed to have been raped by a black man. Mayhem ensued as a white mob invaded the town where blacks were actually in a majority. A couple whites were killed defending the innocent victims of the mob. A store owner in Rosewood tried to fight them off and a couple train conductors ran a train through the whistle stop town scooping up every black they could find to get them the heck out of there. The whole town was burned to the ground.

It is speculated that a large clan rally with the organizing motto of protecting southern womanhood held a week before the massacre in a nearby town is what inspired Taylor's lie.

Again though, this is clearly another situation wher