Marines are breaking under Iraq

[mark3274]

the few the proud the.....................

Cracked.....

http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/11/22/us.marines/index.html

[uppy]

We should increase the size of the military to pre-clinton levels

[TheGoodShepherd]

We should increase the size of the military to pre-clinton levels

Can you? How will you do it? Where you gonna get the soldiers from?

[uppy]

increase the Pay

[mark3274]

We should increase the size of the military to pre-clinton levels

And send more troops to a hopeless cause?

nope....

[K-Gun]

We should increase the size of the military to pre-clinton levels

You do know taht all the cuts that happened while Clinton was Pres were approved in the last Quadrenial under Herbet Walker, don't you?

[K-Gun]

increase the Pay

I second that

[uppy]

And send more troops to a hopeless cause?

nope....

Its only a "hopeless cause" because YOU and people like YOU think it is.

Now when the congress pulls the plug on the Troops I don't want to hear

crap about it being a failed misson.It was never giving a chance from the

get-go by the lefties.....in a nut shell ,if it fails the blood will be on the hands

of the liberals.

[TheGoodShepherd]

increase the Pay

This makes no sense.

[uppy]

You do know taht all the cuts that happened while Clinton was Pres were approved in the last Quadrenial under Herbet Walker, don't you?

their were 18 divisons in the army when clinton took office and 10 when he

left.

I think their were 600 ships in the navy when he took office.....and just over

300 when he left.

Bush 1 never singed off on that.....give me a brake.

[K-Gun]

their were 18 divisons in the army when clinton took office and 10 when he

left.

I think their were 600 ships in the navy when he took office.....and just over

300 when he left.

Bush 1 never singed off on that.....give me a brake.

He ****ing did too. Look it up, and your ex-military Clinton hating friends don't count as sources.

[mark3274]

Its only a "hopeless cause" because YOU and people like YOU think it is.

Now when the congress pulls the plug on the Troops I don't want to hear

crap about it being a failed misson.It was never giving a chance from the

get-go by the lefties.....in a nut shell ,if it fails the blood will be on the hands

of the liberals.

that tired line no longer works.. sorry but republicans are in charge have been for 12 years..... SO if the troops blood is on anyone it is BUshy and his WAr hero donald rumsfeld....

as for the military be increased hell no.... 300 ships hell thats to many there is no soviet navy so off with the fleet the new modern navy will get the job done with 120 ships tops.....
as for army divisions 10 you say... according to the new rumsfeld thinking hell thats way to many...... 6 divisions tops....
they can do it rumsfeld said so.

[uppy]

He ****ing did too. Look it up, and your ex-military Clinton hating friends don't count as sources.

Bush never singed off on cutting the army by 8 divisons..it was done by

clinton and the demo congress in the impeached one's frist two years in office

[uppy]

as for the military be increased hell no.... 300 ships hell thats to many there is no soviet navy so off with the fleet the new modern navy will get the job done with 120 ships tops.....
as for army divisions 10 you say... according to the new rumsfeld thinking hell thats way to many...... 6 divisions tops....
they can do it rumsfeld said so.


blasphemer

[Gibby]

their were 18 divisons in the army when clinton took office and 10 when he

left.

I think their were 600 ships in the navy when he took office.....and just over

300 when he left.

Bush 1 never singed off on that.....give me a brake.

Sorry to break your heart, but yes he did. Starting shortly after Gulf War One when it was becoming increasingly obvious to even the densest cold warrior that the Warsaw Treaty Organization and the USSR were no longer a threat. These cuts started taking place big time in 1991 and 1992. No apocalyptic showdown between Bolshevism and Capitalism to be waged on the North European Plain and therefore no need to have vast military apparatus.

[Gibby]

blasphemer

Yes Rumsfeld was a blasphemer, one more reason I'm glad he's gone. :D

[mark3274]

blasphemer

nope its called rumsfeld the war hero And you know it.

who has been in power for the last 12 years hmmmmm

You have noone to blame but yourselves.
and the blood of the troops is on republican hands no one else.

who set the policy who is the commander in chief.....
wait who said we will be greated as liberator's that was .....

good ole dick

let's see who said the conflict will be over in 6 months....
Rumsfeld..... in fact he said it may not even last 6 weeks...

short memory these repubs but just like in the last failed war they try and blame everyone except themselves for the failure.

admit iraq is a failure it will free your soul uppy.

[Gibby]

nope its called rumsfeld the war hero And you know it.

who has been in power for the last 12 years hmmmmm

You have noone to blame but yourselves.
and the blood of the troops is on republican hands no one else.

who set the policy who is the commander in chief.....
wait who said we will be greated as liberator's that was .....

good ole dick

let's see who said the conflict will be over in 6 months....
Rumsfeld..... in fact he said it may not even last 6 weeks...

short memory these repubs but just like in the last failed war they try and blame everyone except themselves for the failure.

admit iraq is a failure it will free your soul uppy.


So far Mark is winning the battle uppy.

[uppy]

Sorry to break your heart, but yes he did. Starting shortly after Gulf War One when it was becoming increasingly obvious to even the densest cold warrior that the Warsaw Treaty Organization and the USSR were no longer a threat. These cuts started taking place big time in 1991 and 1992. No apocalyptic showdown between Bolshevism and Capitalism to be waged on the North European Plain and therefore no need to have vast military apparatus.


Bullshit, Bush 1 NEVER said we should cut 8 divs. from the army.He was

all for downsizing it some NOT cutting it in 1/2

[JLB]

So far Mark is winning the battle uppy.

Is there a battle where I don't see it.

[uppy]

nope its called rumsfeld the war hero And you know it.

who has been in power for the last 12 years hmmmmm

You have noone to blame but yourselves.
and the blood of the troops is on republican hands no one else.

who set the policy who is the commander in chief.....
wait who said we will be greated as liberator's that was .....

good ole dick

let's see who said the conflict will be over in 6 months....
Rumsfeld..... in fact he said it may not even last 6 weeks...

short memory these repubs but just like in the last failed war they try and blame everyone except themselves for the failure.

admit iraq is a failure it will free your soul uppy.

The battle in Iraq was over in three weeks....we won.

Whats going on now in is the war on terror,Bush said that could last for

10-20 years.

[uppy]

So far Mark is winning the battle uppy.


Go shopping gibby...lol

[г]

The battle in Iraq was over in three weeks....we won.

:rofl:

[mark3274]

The battle in Iraq was over in three weeks....we won.

Whats going on now in is the war on terror,Bush said that could last for

10-20 years.

so iraq had a democracy in full control of its borders and able to police itself in 3 weeks.....
hell if Iraq was won in 3 weeks we should be long gone....

war on terror... name one way Iraq has anything to do with fighting terror.... sounds like a civil war to me and franfly we have no business in someone else's civil war they just have to solve it themselves.

[uppy]

so iraq had a democracy in full control of its borders and able to police itself in 3 weeks.....
hell if Iraq was won in 3 weeks we should be long gone....

war on terror... name one way Iraq has anything to do with fighting terror.... sounds like a civil war to me and franfly we have no business in someone else's civil war they just have to solve it themselves.

Name one way......ok Iran is funding terror ops in Iraq.

When we get a stable Iraq we can work on taking down other terror countrys

in the middle east.

[г]

Iraq is what real estate agents would call a fixer-upper, and what sane people would call a money pit.

[mark3274]

Name one way......ok Iran is funding terror ops in Iraq.

When we get a stable Iraq we can work on taking down other terror countrys

in the middle east.

like who Saudi Arabia ? Iran?

if you thought things were tough in Iraq please invade Iran.....

they will show bushy what a war really means

Iran can sink every single oil tanker trying to pass by in minutes...
now just imagine the USA if gas went to 12 bucks a gallon overnight...... or Imagine a USA with no oil?
yes we would win that battle yup..........

[uppy]

like who Saudi Arabia ? Iran?

if you thought things were tough in Iraq please invade Iran.....

they will show bushy what a war really means

Iran can sink every single oil tanker trying to pass by in minutes...
now just imagine the USA if gas went to 12 bucks a gallon overnight...... or Imagine a USA with no oil?
yes we would win that battle yup..........

We don't get oil from Iran...and if that try to take out a oil tanker we

can bomb their missile sights and sink their ships.We are talking about

a 3d world country Mark not the old USSR

[г]

Good luck with that...

[JLB]

We don't get oil from Iran...and if that try to take out a oil tanker we

can bomb their missile sights and sink their ships.We are talking about

a 3d world country Mark not the old USSR

I would like to beat the crap out of Syria!!!!!

[mark3274]

We don't get oil from Iran...and if that try to take out a oil tanker we

can bomb their missile sights and sink their ships.We are talking about

a 3d world country Mark not the old USSR

Have you been up on Irans Missile capability latly nope...

even if we did bomb their sites..... did you forget the recent battle with Hezzbollah? Do you really think a few bomb runs will stop the battle.... Israel thought so to and yet the rockets came day and night........... and It will not take much to stop the flow of oil out of the gulf...

Now just think what will happen to gas prices and America if we could not get oil from the gulf.........
Your underestimating your opponent same mistake bushy made........
where does Iran get it's anti ship missiles from?
did hellbolah not hit a Israel war ship..... sure shocked them now did they not...
How could a third world nation fight the mighty us military......
ponders.........
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article7147.htm

uppy this is the sundowner.... FYI the US navy is terrified of this weapon... because they cannot defeat it nor stop it... one sundowner will send a carrier even the HW BUSH to the bottom of the ocean ..
a few thousand french missiles will stop all flow of oil from the gulf....
so let's ask say Pete..... what would no oil do to the us economy and how long would it take.... 3 weeks? I say in 2 weeks we would be in such a panick that Bush would have a real BIG mess on his hands.

[JoeMama]

We should increase the size of the military to pre-clinton levels

LOL!

It wasn't Clinton who decided to go into Iraq without enough troops to keep the peace.

It was your boy, Rummy.

[uppy]

Have you been up on Irans Missile capability latly nope...

even if we did bomb their sites..... did you forget the recent battle with Hezzbollah? Do you really think a few bomb runs will stop the battle.... Israel thought so to and yet the rockets came day and night........... and It will not take much to stop the flow of oil out of the gulf...


No, more like what we did to the Nazis. I suppose that would entail a bit of

pummeling cities into rubble, but it very clearly does solve things in the long run.

If we don't beat them their will never be peace

[Proteus]

Its only a "hopeless cause" because YOU and people like YOU think it is.

Now when the congress pulls the plug on the Troops I don't want to hear

crap about it being a failed misson.It was never giving a chance from the

get-go by the lefties.....in a nut shell ,if it fails the blood will be on the hands

of the liberals.

No idiot, it's a hopeless cause because no matter how many troops with have over there they are going to be an open target. Removing Saddam allowed for the civil war to begin in Iraq. Now our troops are caught in the middle. The civil war is happening and our troops will be a target as long as it goes on. There is nothing we can do to stop it. It is inevitable now. I know personal attacks are not supposed to be allowed, but upstart you are such a ****ing moron I can't help myself.

[TheGoodShepherd]

What's scariest about upstart's adamant personality is it similiarites to crazed-out mullahs heaving hell in Iraq.

[JoeMama]

What's scariest about upstart's adamant personality is it similiarites to crazed-out mullahs heaving hell in Iraq.

Well, anyone who suggests we should reduce Iraq to a smoldering crater then start from scratch is the American equivalent of Osama bin Laden. Which is scary.

[uppy]

No idiot, it's a hopeless cause because no matter how many troops with have over there they are going to be an open target. Removing Saddam allowed for the civil war to begin in Iraq. Now our troops are caught in the middle. The civil war is happening and our troops will be a target as long as it goes on. There is nothing we can do to stop it. It is inevitable now. I know personal attacks are not supposed to be allowed, but upstart you are such a ****ing moron I can't help myself.


If you likk enough of them,thay will stop fighting

~Gen.Curtis LeMay

[TheGoodShepherd]

If you likk enough of them,thay will stop fighting

~Gen.Curtis LeMay

Don't be so quick to commit US lives to a bias in the head screaming Americans are in immediate danger. For someone who professes himself a patriot, you sure do retain a nasty habit of making decisions for Americans you've never met.

[JLB]

LOL!

It wasn't Clinton who decided to go into Iraq without enough troops to keep the peace.

It was your boy, Rummy.

Rummy now there's a name out of the past.
Who replaces him?

[Angus]

Its only a "hopeless cause" because YOU and people like YOU think it is.

Now when the congress pulls the plug on the Troops I don't want to hear

crap about it being a failed misson.It was never giving a chance from the

get-go by the lefties.....in a nut shell ,if it fails the blood will be on the hands

of the liberals.


Never given a chance from the get go by lefties? The right has had its way entirely in this war for going on 4 years now. The right has had every chance to win this war. You might not have noticed it but the right has been in complete charge of the House, the Senate and the White House since before this war began. They have had a blank check from the "get-go" and they have failed. Failed miserably. But go ahead, pretend its the fault of the left. The mission, no matter what the future may hold, has thus far failed my friend and every single drop of blood spilled so far is on your hands, not the left's. Stand up and be a man, take responsibility for the policies you have advocated and the lives they have cost. Your support for incompetent leaders whose every failing you excuse has cost this nation dearly. Lives, treasure, international respect. All gone. Good going. Take a bow.

[JLB]

Don't be so quick to commit US lives to a bias in the head screaming Americans are in immediate danger. For someone who professes himself a patriot, you sure do retain a nasty habit of making decisions for Americans you've never met.

So does everybody on here.
The point is what do you really know?

[mark3274]

Rummy now there's a name out of the past.
Who replaces him?

DADDY's BOI thats who

GW-- "daddy i sure did screw up"
HW--" you sure the hell did from now on shut the hell up I make all the decisions for the next 2 years"

[JLB]

Never given a chance from the get go by lefties? The right has had its way entirely in this war for going on 4 years now. The right has had every chance to win this war. You might not have noticed it but the right has been in complete charge of the House, the Senate and the White House since before this war began. They have had a blank check from the "get-go" and they have failed. Failed miserably. But go ahead, pretend its the fault of the left. The mission, no matter what the future may hold, has thus far failed my friend and every single drop of blood spilled so far is on your hands, not the left's. Stand up and be a man, take responsibility for the policies you have advocated and the lives they have cost. Your support for incompetent leaders whose every failing you excuse has cost this nation dearly. Lives, treasure, international respect. All gone. Good going. Take a bow.

What in hell are you talking about?

[uppy]

Don't be so quick to commit US lives to a bias in the head screaming Americans are in immediate danger. For someone who professes himself a patriot, you sure do retain a nasty habit of making decisions for Americans you've never met.


No,chimpie if we fight this war with our might it will save our troops lives.

I am an American I have opinions on what MY country does

[JLB]

DADDY's BOI thats who

GW-- "daddy i sure did screw up"
HW--" you sure the hell did from now on shut the hell up I make all the decisions for the next 2 years"

Name please.

[mark3274]

Name please.

Robert Gates

You did not know this?

[JLB]

Robert Gates

You did not know this?

Thanks for reminding me whats this guys background and will he be approved?

[TheGoodShepherd]

No,chimpie if we fight this war with our might it will save our troops lives.

I am an American I have opinions on what MY country does

And I'm sure posing to all of us as a deficient, yet ardent dealer of death, makes upstart sleep comfortably each and every night.

[mark3274]

Thanks for reminding me whats this guys background and will he be approved?

he was daddy bush's CIA head... of course he'll get apporoved anyone is better than Rumsfeld a total and complete failure that guy was...

Iraq is going to civil war as we speak......

[JLB]

he was daddy bush's CIA head... of course he'll get apporoved anyone is better than Rumsfeld a total and complete failure that guy was...

Iraq is going to civil war as we speak......

So you do approve of this guy?

[uppy]

quote by moonbat
Never given a chance from the get go by lefties? The right has had its way entirely in this war for going on 4 years now

You lefties have been aiding and abetting the enemy for 4 years now

don't give me that shit


You might not have noticed it but the right has been in complete charge of the House, the Senate and the White House since before this war began. They have had a blank check from the "get-go" and they have failed. Failed miserably

And you might have noticed the left has been trying to hurt the administration

ability to fight the war on terror from the start...instead of getting behind

the country in a time of war,just like the left did back durring Nam.

But go ahead, pretend its the fault of the left. The mission, no matter what the future may hold, has thus far failed my friend and every single drop of blood spilled so far is on your hands, not the left's. Stand up and be a man, take responsibility for the policies you have advocated and the lives they have cost.

I'm not pretending you guys are..you think its all a politcal game and you

hurt this country and it will come back and bite us in the ass when all is

said and done.

Stand up and be a man, take responsibility for the policies you have advocated and the lives they have cost. Your support for incompetent leaders whose every failing you excuse has cost this nation dearly. Lives, treasure, international respect. All gone. Good going. Take a bow.

Yup and when the congress pulls the funding for the war on terror and

we came home you can take a bow .....when a nuke goes off in one of

our citys.

But...we all know the moonbats will blame Bush

[mark3274]

So you do approve of this guy?

He has not spoken much of what his Ideas are as of yet but over rummy yes he is a step up....

even daddy bush knew Iraq was a mess and not to get involved in that He at least seemed to know far better than gw did about what the result would be.

Look at the history of this region... hell the muslims have been here since the ottoman empire maybe before that there way of life is entrenched.. we can not just come along and say hey our way is better.

[JLB]

He has not spoken much of what his Ideas are as of yet but over rummy yes he is a step up....

even daddy bush knew Iraq was a mess and not to get involved in that He at least seemed to know far better than gw did about what the result would be.

Look at the history of this region... hell the muslims have been here since the ottoman empire maybe before that there way of life is entrenched.. we can not just come along and say hey our way is better.

You seem slightly interested in daddy so tell me this when did daddy have his country attacked by a bunch of *******s?

[Proteus]

You lefties have been aiding and abetting the enemy for 4 years now

don't give me that shit




And you might have noticed the left has been trying to hurt the administration

ability to fight the war on terror from the start...instead of getting behind

the country in a time of war,just like the left did back durring Nam.



I'm not pretending you guys are..you think its all a politcal game and you

hurt this country and it will come back and bite us in the ass when all is

said and done.



Yup and when the congress pulls the funding for the war on terror and

we came home you can take a bow .....when a nuke goes off in one of

our citys.

But...we all know the moonbats will blame Bush

So when we were hunting Osama in Afghanistan and we knew where he was was that the libs fault too. That' right we knew exactly where Osama was, we were listening to him communicate with his soldiers over a radio we had picked up from one of his dead soldiers. This was during the battle of Tora Bora in case you want to research it. You know research something you never do before you post. We left it to Afghan and Pakistani troops to block the escape routs. The American forces on the ground wanted to bring in 600-800 special forces soldiers to block the routs instead but our commander in chief said no. Somehow Osama escaped, imagine that. Now we have a pretty good idea of where he is. A mountain region around the border of Afghanistan and Pakistan that is actually very close to China. Why don't we go in and get him? Because Pakistan won't allow US troops in there. You have no idea what you are talking about and I feel for you to blanket all liberals as supporters of terrorism is wrong and is not American.

[Proteus]

You lefties have been aiding and abetting the enemy for 4 years now

don't give me that shit




Give me one example, or is this just something you said with no facts to back it up like everything else you say.

[mark3274]

You seem slightly interested in daddy so tell me this when did daddy have his country attacked by a bunch of *******s?

true... but what does Iraq have to do with that?

Now bushy jr did the right thing in afganny but then he lost his way ..... If he had stayed the course in afganny maybe the Taliban would not be making a comeback....

The "war on terror" and Iraq have nothing in common.

[JLB]

So when we were hunting Osama in Afghanistan and we knew where he was was that the libs fault too. That' right we knew exactly where Osama was, we were listening to him communicate with his soldiers over a radio we had picked up from one of his dead soldiers. This was during the battle of Tora Bora in case you want to research it. You know research something you never do before you post. We left it to Afghan and Pakistani troops to block the escape routs. The American forces on the ground wanted to bring in 600-800 special forces soldiers to block the routs instead but our commander in chief said no. Somehow Osama escaped, imagine that. Now we have a pretty good idea of where he is. A mountain region around the border of Afghanistan and Pakistan that is actually very close to China. Why don't we go in and get him? Because Pakistan won't allow US troops in there. You have no idea what you are talking about and I feel for you to blanket all liberals as supporters of terrorism is wrong and is not American.

Quit blaming Clinton for ****ing up so much he did his best.

[JLB]

true... but what does Iraq have to do with that?

Now bushy jr did the right thing in afganny but then he lost his way ..... If he had stayed the course in afganny maybe the Taliban would not be making a comeback....

The "war on terror" and Iraq have nothing in common.

Funny thats exactly what I was gonna ask you since you brought him up.
this is your quote right?



even daddy bush knew Iraq was a mess and not to get involved in that He at least seemed to know far better than gw did about what the result would be.

[Proteus]

And you might have noticed the left has been trying to hurt the administration

ability to fight the war on terror from the start...instead of getting behind

the country in a time of war,just like the left did back durring Nam.





So we should get rid of free speech and keep our mouths shut no matter how much we disagree with what our beloved country is doing. What if we decided to attack Canada today. Should we keep our mouths shut and support our troops. I protested going to war in Iraq and guess what I was right. People who speak out against the war and our leaders are doing the country a great service. It's the foundation this country is built on. It's *******s like you that try to tie together us not supporting a war with not supporting the troops to serve your own purposes. Your blind support for this war is quite pathetic and your denial that it is not going well just means you are lying or misinformed. In either case you should not be posting on it. Do me a favor and buy a clue.

[mark3274]

Quit blaming Clinton for ****ing up so much he did his best.

now everyone is always blaming clinton for this...

9-11 happened on BUSH's watch..

Bush'y said i will get osama dead or alive.... not bill...

[JLB]

So we should get rid of free speech and keep our mouths shut no matter how much we disagree with what our beloved country is doing. What if we decided to attack Canada today. Should we keep our mouths shut and support our troops. I protested going to war in Iraq and guess what I was right. People who speak out against the war and our leaders are doing the country a great service. It's the foundation this country is built on. It's *******s like you that try to tie together us not supporting a war with not supporting the troops to serve your own purposes. Your blind support for this war is quite pathetic and your denial that it is not going well just means you are lying or misinformed. In either case you should not be posting on it. Do me a favor and buy a clue.

Please don't give up that speech many brave men died for you to have that right. Just don't **** it up now make em proud they fought and died for your rights. Do you think they shoulda died for your rights? Would it have been better if they just pissed in their ****ing pants and said **** it.

[JLB]

now everyone is always blaming clinton for this...

9-11 happened on BUSH's watch..

Bush'y said i will get osama dead or alive.... not bill...

Clinton did no such thing he didn't have the time or energy blow jobs were way to ****ing important.

[Proteus]

Please don't give up that speech many brave men died for you to have that right. Just don't **** it up now make em proud they fought and died for your rights. Do you think they shoulda died for your rights? Would it have been better if they just pissed in their ****ing pants and said **** it.

I don't think you understood my post. I support free speech.

[deconstruction]

increase the Pay

Probably a good idea.

[JLB]

I don't think you understood my post. I support free speech.

I know you do.
I always have trouble if I feel in anyway that the military is being disrespected.
I will always come out ****ing hard when I think thats happening at any ****ing time.
Be good appreciate those rights those guys got for ya thats all.

[mark3274]

Clinton did no such thing he didn't have the time or energy blow jobs were way to ****ing important.

well if bushy had more bj's maybe we woulda never got in this mess LOL....

[shiva2999]

I wonder if uppy's ever considered being a "private contracter" in Iraq?

You'd think a guy with his skill set could pull down a couple hundred gees a year working as a merc.

Plus, you have the bonus of not being under the jurisdiction of US or Iraqi law.

You can rape, pillage and plunder as much as you want and no one can do anything about it other than shoot you.

[JLB]

well if bushy had more bj's maybe we woulda never got in this mess LOL....

Your right that ********** Clinton was a mother ****ing joke lol.

[JLB]

I wonder if uppy's ever considered being a "private contracter" in Iraq?

You'd think a guy with his skill set could pull down a couple hundred gees a year working as a merc.

Plus, you have the bonus of not being under the jurisdiction of US or Iraqi law.

You can rape, pillage and plunder as much as you want and no one can do anything about it other than shoot you.

LMAO funny stuff are you ever serious?

[shiva2999]

I always try to have a serious point, no matter how I choose to present it.

[JoeMama]

Clinton did no such thing he didn't have the time or energy blow jobs were way to ****ing important.

It's interesting that Bill Clinton gets so much shit from Republicans about the failure to capture Osama bin Laden.

Bill Clinton issued an executive order to have OBL assassinated, which Republicans opposed at the time.

Bill Clinton authorized the military to attack targets in Sudan in order to kill Osama bin Laden. Republicans considered it "wag the dog" at the time.

Bill Clinton tripled the anti-terrorism budget in order to fight Osama bin Laden. Republicans opposed the increase tooth & nail.

Bill Clinton gave the Bush Administration a full report on Osama bin Laden that basically said, "Keep your eye on this guy, he's going to cause problems for US security."

And, of course, the Bush Administration ignored it entirely. As well as the memo that flat out said Osama bin Laden was going to attack the US on 9-11.

And to this date, no one in US history has come closer to capturing Osama bin Laden than Bill Clinton.

Yet Bill Clinton is still the "fall guy" for dumbass Republicans who are either too stupid or too ignorant to recognize the fact that Bill Clinton actually attempted to get Osama bin Laden & came very close -- as opposed to their hero, George Bush, who has virtually abandoned the hunt & completely ignored Osama bin Laden since day one of his presidency.

The point is, you really have to sit back & enjoy the irony that the same Republicans who criticized Bill Clinton for going after Osama bin Laden back in the 1990's, are now the same Republicans who criticize him for not doing enough.

LOL!

Now that's a flip-flop.

[Soviet_Canuckastani]

increase the Pay


Tax'n'spend tax'n'spend, that's all you neocons have been good for lately isn't it?

[35Pete]

the few the proud the.....................

Cracked.....

http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/11/22/us.marines/index.html

Read the story. This is a bull shit deceptive mischaracterization.

[ticatfan3]

It's interesting that Bill Clinton gets so much shit from Republicans about the failure to capture Osama bin Laden.

Bill Clinton issued an executive order to have OBL assassinated, which Republicans opposed at the time.

Bill Clinton authorized the military to attack targets in Sudan in order to kill Osama bin Laden. Republicans considered it "wag the dog" at the time.

Bill Clinton tripled the anti-terrorism budget in order to fight Osama bin Laden. Republicans opposed the increase tooth & nail.

Bill Clinton gave the Bush Administration a full report on Osama bin Laden that basically said, "Keep your eye on this guy, he's going to cause problems for US security."

And, of course, the Bush Administration ignored it entirely. As well as the memo that flat out said Osama bin Laden was going to attack the US on 9-11.

And to this date, no one in US history has come closer to capturing Osama bin Laden than Bill Clinton.

Yet Bill Clinton is still the "fall guy" for dumbass Republicans who are either too stupid or too ignorant to recognize the fact that Bill Clinton actually attempted to get Osama bin Laden & came very close -- as opposed to their hero, George Bush, who has virtually abandoned the hunt & completely ignored Osama bin Laden since day one of his presidency.

The point is, you really have to sit back & enjoy the irony that the same Republicans who criticized Bill Clinton for going after Osama bin Laden back in the 1990's, are now the same Republicans who criticize him for not doing enough.

LOL!

Now that's a flip-flop.
:clapper:

[JLB]

It's interesting that Bill Clinton gets so much shit from Republicans about the failure to capture Osama bin Laden.

Bill Clinton issued an executive order to have OBL assassinated, which Republicans opposed at the time.

Bill Clinton authorized the military to attack targets in Sudan in order to kill Osama bin Laden. Republicans considered it "wag the dog" at the time.

Bill Clinton tripled the anti-terrorism budget in order to fight Osama bin Laden. Republicans opposed the increase tooth & nail.

Bill Clinton gave the Bush Administration a full report on Osama bin Laden that basically said, "Keep your eye on this guy, he's going to cause problems for US security."

And, of course, the Bush Administration ignored it entirely. As well as the memo that flat out said Osama bin Laden was going to attack the US on 9-11.

And to this date, no one in US history has come closer to capturing Osama bin Laden than Bill Clinton.

Yet Bill Clinton is still the "fall guy" for dumbass Republicans who are either too stupid or too ignorant to recognize the fact that Bill Clinton actually attempted to get Osama bin Laden & came very close -- as opposed to their hero, George Bush, who has virtually abandoned the hunt & completely ignored Osama bin Laden since day one of his presidency.

The point is, you really have to sit back & enjoy the irony that the same Republicans who criticized Bill Clinton for going after Osama bin Laden back in the 1990's, are now the same Republicans who criticize him for not doing enough.

LOL!

Now that's a flip-flop.

I admire his blowjob expertise but thats about it.
We'll never know why he didn't kill Bin Laden though.
He had plenty of ****ing opportunity.
He just didn't have the balls.
Why doesn't Clionton deserve some of the blame?

[uppy]

I wonder if uppy's ever considered being a "private contracter" in Iraq?

You'd think a guy with his skill set could pull down a couple hundred gees a year working as a merc.




I served my Country to help keep it free.....not for money.

I have told you before,I don't care about money.

[uppy]

Give me one example, or is this just something you said with no facts to back it up like everything else you say.

quote=poteus
So we should get rid of free speech and keep our mouths shut no matter how much we disagree with what our beloved country is doing. What if we decided to attack Canada today. Should we keep our mouths shut and support our troops. I protested going to war in Iraq and guess what I was right. People who speak out against the war and our leaders are doing the country a great service. It's the foundation this country is built on. It's *******s like you that try to tie together us not supporting a war with not supporting the troops to serve your own purposes. Your blind support for this war is quite pathetic and your denial that it is not going well just means you are lying or misinformed. In either case you should not be posting on it. Do me a favor and buy a clue.

Case in point

[ticatfan3]

I admire his blowjob expertise but thats about it.
We'll never know why he didn't kill Bin Laden though.
He had plenty of ****ing opportunity.
He just didn't have the balls.
Why doesn't Clionton deserve some of the blame?How do you know he had plenty of opportunities?

[JLB]

How do you know he had plenty of opportunities?

MSM !!

[uppy]

Tax'n'spend tax'n'spend, that's all you neocons have been good for lately isn't it?


We could always cut welfare to pay for the increase.

[35Pete]

If Iran started blowing up tankers I'd bet 99.9999% of the loons here would be screaming

"US out of the Persian Gulf"

"No Blood For Oil"

Then hop in their GASOLINE powered vehicle because there is a "can't miss" protest downtown tonight.

[uppy]

How do you know he had plenty of opportunities?

Ticat....is that you or did chimpie get your password ?

[uppy]

If Iran started blowing up tankers I'd bet 99.9999% of the loons here would be screaming

"US out of the Persian Gulf"

"No Blood For Oil"

Then hop in their GASOLINE powered vehicle because there is a "can't miss" protest downtown tonight.


You got that right Pete.

[shiva2999]

I served my Country to help keep it free.....not for money.

I have told you before,I don't care about money.

You could go kill terrorists and put the money in a trust fund for your daughter.

Win-win.

[uppy]

You could go kill terrorists and put the money in a trust fund for your daughter.

Win-win.

Private contracters don't engage in military ops....thay mostly guard things.

Also if I did go you would miss me.

[JoeMama]

I admire his blowjob expertise but thats about it.
We'll never know why he didn't kill Bin Laden though.
He had plenty of ****ing opportunity.
He just didn't have the balls.
Why doesn't Clionton deserve some of the blame?

Because it's a myth that he had "plenty" of opportunities.

And look, no one is saying Bill Clinton is blameless. I think Clinton himself said it best when he stated, "I tried & I failed. But at least I tried. That's the difference between me & some others."

"Some others" being George Bush.

And again, the fact of the matter is that no president has come closer to assassinating Osama bin Laden than Bill Clinton.

So anyone who sits here & parrots this ridiculous notion that Bill Clinton is the ultimate culprit for 9-11 is an absolute dipshit.

[shiva2999]

Private contracters don't engage in military ops....thay mostly guard things.

You could kill terrorists in your spare time.

[mark3274]

If Iran started blowing up tankers I'd bet 99.9999% of the loons here would be screaming

"US out of the Persian Gulf"

"No Blood For Oil"

Then hop in their GASOLINE powered vehicle because there is a "can't miss" protest downtown tonight.

and what would you be doing waiting on the beach with your sun glasses on hey whats that bright flash over Miami there... shit it's a little hot here................ hey why is Miami burning up like that....

damn it.... Toatal war...... And republicans would be the first to scream if they was no oil for there suvs........

[uppy]

and what would you be doing waiting on the beach with your sun glasses on hey whats that bright flash over Miami there... shit it's a little hot here................ hey why is Miami burning up like that....

damn it.... Toatal war...... And republicans would be the first to scream if they was no oil for there suvs........

If you libbys let us drill for oil in our country we'd have no need for middle east

oil.....its the lefts fault

[uppy]

You could kill terrorists in your spare time.

You'd still miss me to much

[shiva2999]

You'd still miss me to much

I'm prepared to make the sacrifice.

[ticatfan3]

Ticat....is that you or did chimpie get your password ?No it is me ,but come on now you can not dump it all on clinton.

[uppy]

I'm prepared to make the sacrifice.

I see...for the good of the country ?

[uppy]

No it is me ,but come on now you can not dump it all on clinton.

I can and I will ,every chance I get....plus don't forget clinton gave

the chi-coms all the info on how to make their missiles hit us.

[shiva2999]

I see...for the good of the country ?

For truth, justice and the American way.

[JLB]

No it is me ,but come on now you can not dump it all on clinton.


How about you dump some on Clinton what do you say?

[JLB]

Because it's a myth that he had "plenty" of opportunities.

And look, no one is saying Bill Clinton is blameless. I think Clinton himself said it best when he stated, "I tried & I failed. But at least I tried. That's the difference between me & some others."

"Some others" being George Bush.

And again, the fact of the matter is that no president has come closer to assassinating Osama bin Laden than Bill Clinton.

So anyone who sits here & parrots this ridiculous notion that Bill Clinton is the ultimate culprit for 9-11 is an absolute dipshit.

I'm not saying everything should fall to him just a good amount of it.
As you say he said he failed I give him credit for saying it.
But some on here would have you believe he was snow freakin white thats just not what I see.
Lets say this there is definately plenty of blame to go around.
Question should be what the **** we gonna do about it besides blame Bush thats ****ing worthless.

[uppy]

For truth, justice and the American way.

You're starting to see the light !

[JoeMama]

I'm not saying everything should fall to him just a good amount of it.
As you say he said he failed I give him credit for saying it.
But some on here would have you believe he was snow freakin white thats just not what I see.
Lets say this there is definately plenty of blame to go around.
Question should be what the **** we gonna do about it besides blame Bush thats ****ing worthless.

That's awful disingenuous.

Who are you to suggest it's "worthless" to hold certain politicians accountable for 9-11?

Excuse me, but you wrote a post in this thread where you blamed Bill Clinton for getting blowjobs instead of getting Osama bin Laden.

Which is complete bullshit since Bill Clinton actually did more to capture Osama bin Laden than George Bush has even dreamed of doing.

So let's not get carried away with lecturing others about playing the blame game.

You obviously have no problem pointing your finger at Bill Clinton, even for charges that are completely fallacious.

And you know me. I think Bush deserves 99% of the shit he gets.

He completely ignored Osama bin Laden prior to 9-11.

Then he quit searching for Osama bin Laden shortly after 9-11.

When it you contrast their stances on Osama bin Laden; the cold hard truth is that Bill Clinton is the good guy & George Bush is the bad guy.

And that settles it.

[uppy]

Ummm Joe, Bush was in office for less then a year when 9/11 happend.

Where as clinton had his thumb up his ass for 8 years

[shiva2999]

Ummm Joe, Bush was in office for less then a year when 9/11 happend.

Where as clinton had his thumb up his ass for 8 years

The Bushies had a long time to plan it.

That's the reason 9/11 is the only thing they've got remotely right.

[uppy]

The Bushies had a long time to plan it.

That's the reason 9/11 is the only thing they've got remotely right.

lol

So the old man was in on the Job ?

When we where their in "90" we had the forces to bring down the hole

Middle East......why did he what until his son was in office ?

[chickie]

The Bushies had a long time to plan it.

That's the reason 9/11 is the only thing they've got remotely right.

Ok let's just assume that your theory is correct. If the "Bushies" really planned this then why was one of the planes targeted for Washington?

Why would they want to kill themselves and their family and friends?

[chickie]

lol

So the old man was in on the Job ?

When we where their in "90" we had the forces to bring down the hole

Middle East......why did he what until his son was in office ?

It was all pre-planned Uppy, didn't you know? The America public just happen to fall for Bush and elect him into office. What were the chances of that?

[uppy]

Good question

[JoeMama]

Ummm Joe, Bush was in office for less then a year when 9/11 happend.

Where as clinton had his thumb up his ass for 8 years

LOL!

I recognize that it's difficult to debate rationally with wingnuts, but I'm willing to test my own patience & try.

So read carefully.

Bill Clinton was stonewalled by the Republicans every time he attempted to do anything about Osama bin Laden during his presidency.

When he authorized the executive order to have OBL assassinated? Republican outcry.

When refused to withdraw US forces Somalia immediately after Black Hawk Down? Republican outcry.

When he took military action in Sudan against al Qaeda? Republican outcry.

When he tripled the anti-terrorism budget? Republican outcry.

When he put together a battle plan to attack Afghanistan, defeat the Taliban, & capture Osama bin Laden? You guessed it. Republican outcry.

Ironically, Clinton's plan to attack Afghanistan was rejected by the CIA because the agency refused to authenticate that OBL was indeed responsible for various attacks on the US during the 1990's; ranging from al Qaeda's attack on the US embassy in Sudan, to their attack on the USS Cole.

Perhaps even more ironic is that George Bush actually awarded George Tenet the Presidential Medal of Freedom for what can only be described as complete & utter incompetence; not only in regard to OBL, but especially in regard to the case against Iraq, where his WMD claims turned out to be a joke.

But, almost predictably, the second 9-11 occured, something amazing happened. Where did the Republicans focus their outcry?

Bill Clinton.

The same man they reviled for 8 long years for doing too much to capture OBL, they now blame for 9-11.

LOL!

You guys are such a bunch of no-memory having mother****ers.

Honestly, how you morons even manage to breathe, let alone form political opinions, is beyond me.

So don't give me this bullshit that Bill Clinton did nothing for 8 years. It's disingenuous. You know it. I know it. Anyone with even half a brain knows it.

And you know who else knows it?

George Bush.

Because he got a big-ass, comprehensive report on Osama bin Laden the day he entered office.

And he ignored it because he & his adminstration are completely & utterly incompetent.

[JLB]

Who are you to suggest it's "worthless" to hold certain politicians accountable for 9-11?

I'm suggesting that it accomplishes little or nothing.
Because there are so many you could point a finger at.
It means the argument is worthless but it continues.
Get a plan that will accomplish the goal thats worth something.

[shiva2999]

lol

So the old man was in on the Job ?

When we where their in "90" we had the forces to bring down the hole

Middle East......why did he what until his son was in office ?

9/11 and taking out Saddam were planned for Poppy's second term.

Unfortunately, Bill Clinton got in the way.

Why do you think Repubs hated him so much?

[shiva2999]

Ok let's just assume that your theory is correct. If the "Bushies" really planned this then why was one of the planes targeted for Washington?

Why would they want to kill themselves and their family and friends?

What plane was targeted for Washington, other than the one that hit the Pentagon (whatever it was)?

[shiva2999]

I'm suggesting that it accomplishes little or nothing.
Because there are so many you could point a finger at.
It means the argument is worthless but it continues.
Get a plan that will accomplish the goal thats worth something.

First part of plan?

Throw Bushy mass murderers in jail.

[uppy]

I will get back to this thread soon

[uppy]

LOL!

I recognize that it's difficult to debate rationally with wingnuts, but I'm willing to test my own patience & try.

So read carefully.

Bill Clinton was stonewalled by the Republicans every time he attempted to do anything about Osama bin Laden during his presidency.

Bullshit Joe...clinton was the CIC of the military...he could have acted

He did not

When he authorized the executive order to have OBL assassinated? Republican outcry.

When refused to withdraw US forces Somalia immediately after Black Hawk Down? Republican outcry.

The GOP wanted him to let the army do its job he did not give them

the tools to carry out the mission thats why

When he took military action in Sudan against al Qaeda? Republican outcry.

He bombed an aspirin factory...it was wag the dog day

When he tripled the anti-terrorism budget? Republican outcry.

When he put together a battle plan to attack Afghanistan, defeat the Taliban, & capture Osama bin Laden? You guessed it. Republican outcry.

clinton put toghter a battle plan.....rotflmao

Ironically, Clinton's plan to attack Afghanistan was rejected by the CIA because the agency refused to authenticate that OBL was indeed responsible for various attacks on the US during the 1990's; ranging from al Qaeda's attack on the US embassy in Sudan, to their attack on the USS Cole.

clinton was the CIC....he let the CIA I thought it was his job to lead

the country...and not let the CIA tell him what to do

Perhaps even more ironic is that George Bush actually awarded George Tenet the Presidential Medal of Freedom for what can only be described as complete & utter incompetence; not only in regard to OBL, but especially in regard to the case against Iraq, where his WMD claims turned out to be a joke.

George Tenet was clinton's boy...GWB ,for reasons unknown let him

stay as the head of the CIA,the guy was a moron and should have been

let go the day Bush took office.



But, almost predictably, the second 9-11 occured, something amazing happened. Where did the Republicans focus their outcry?

Bill Clinton.

The same man they reviled for 8 long years for doing too much to capture OBL, they now blame for 9-11.

LOL!

You guys are such a bunch of no-memory having mother****ers.

Honestly, how you morons even manage to breathe, let alone form political opinions, is beyond me.

So don't give me this bullshit that Bill Clinton did nothing for 8 years. It's disingenuous. You know it. I know it. Anyone with even half a brain knows it.

And you know who else knows it?

George Bush.

Because he got a big-ass, comprehensive report on Osama bin Laden the day he entered office.

And he ignored it because he & his adminstration are completely & utterly incompetent.

clinton never cared about his job to defend this country....it was a game to

him....he with the help of Ross the boss won the prize

[uppy]

9/11 and taking out Saddam were planned for Poppy's second term.

Unfortunately, Bill Clinton got in the way.

Why do you think Repubs hated him so much?

I was on the ground in 90 we could have taken it down in days

Bush was at the top of his game then why would he wait until his Son

was prez to do it.....give it up my man.

[shiva2999]

I was on the ground in 90 we could have taken it down in days

Bush was at the top of his game then why would he wait until his Son

was prez to do it.....give it up my man.

I answered your question.

Don't you understand English?

[uppy]

I answered your question.

Don't you understand English?

I must have missed it please re- post it

[JLB]

9/11 and taking out Saddam were planned for Poppy's second term.

Unfortunately, Bill Clinton got in the way.

Why do you think Repubs hated him so much?


It wasn't Bill Cinton it was R.P. that got in the way.

R.P.=Ross Perot!!!

[shiva2999]

I must have missed it please re- post it

You quoted it.

[uppy]

point it out for me

[shiva2999]

Post 113.

[JoeMama]

Bullshit Joe...clinton was the CIC of the military...he could have acted

He did not

...

The GOP wanted him to let the army do its job he did not give them

the tools to carry out the mission thats why

...

clinton put toghter a battle plan.....rotflmao
...

clinton was the CIC....he let the CIA I thought it was his job to lead

the country...and not let the CIA tell him what to do


What the **** are you talking about?

Bill Clinton tripled the anti-terrorism budget, issued an executive order to assassinate Osama bin Laden, & authorized strikes in Sudan, Somalia, & attempted strikes in Afghanistan.

You keep repeating this dumbass rhetoric about "Oh, Bill Clinton was CIC, he can do whatever he wants!" like the president of the United States is some kind of ****ing king with unlimited powers to just do whatever.

Which is so incredibly stupid, I don't even know where to start with you.

To your chagrin, there is such a thing as a political process that has checks & balances in this country. As much as you'd love to just give George Bush the crown, the robes, & the sceptor, America is not a monarchy. The president still needs approval on many levels of gov't to take military action in foreign countries.

And if you'd pull your head out of your ass for five ****ing seconds, you'd recall that starting a war requires basing rights.

Bill Clinton needed basing rights in order to lead a large scale military strike against the Taliban. And here's the thing. Even though Clinton already had an agreement in place with Uzbekistan to establish basing rights & already had military leaders draw up a battle plan -- George Tenet & the CIA wouldn't give him the authorization to finalize the deal because they refused to definitively pin the bombings in Sudan & the USS Cole on Osama bin Laden.

So **** you with your bullshit.

Clinton was stonewalled like crazy.

He bombed an aspirin factory...it was wag the dog day


Funny.

Clinton authorizes military strikes in Sudan to get Osama bin Laden. It's wag the dog.

If Clinton didn't authrize military strikes in Sudan to get Osama bin Laden. It's he was more interested in getting blowjobs.

LOL!

Talk about a rock & a hard place.

But that's the Republican dichotomy for you.

And either way, the reality is, Clinton did far more than Bush about Osama bin Laden -- & to this day -- is still the president that came closest to killing the guy.

All this despite the fact that Osama bin Laden was virtually unknown to 80% of the American public & despite the fact that Clinton had to fight the Republicans every step of the way.

[uppy]

post 113 ??

Originally Posted by shiva2999
9/11 and taking out Saddam were planned for Poppy's second term.

Unfortunately, Bill Clinton got in the way.

Why do you think Repubs hated him so much?



I was on the ground in 90 we could have taken it down in days

Bush was at the top of his game then why would he wait until his Son

was prez to do it.....give it up my man

What the hell are you talking about ?

[uppy]

What the **** are you talking about?

Bill Clinton tripled the anti-terrorism budget, issued an executive order to assassinate Osama bin Laden, & authorized strikes in Sudan, Somalia, & attempted strikes in Afghanistan.

You keep repeating this dumbass rhetoric about "Oh, Bill Clinton was CIC, he can do whatever he wants!" like the president of the United States is some kind of ****ing king with unlimited powers to just do whatever.

Which is so incredibly stupid, I don't even know where to start with you.

To your chagrin, there is such a thing as a political process that has checks & balances in this country. As much as you'd love to just give George Bush the crown, the robes, & the sceptor, America is not a monarchy. The president still needs approval on many levels of gov't to take military action in foreign countries.

And if you'd pull your head out of your ass for five ****ing seconds, you'd recall that starting a war requires basing rights.

Bill Clinton needed basing rights in order to lead a large scale military strike against the Taliban. And here's the thing. Even though Clinton already had an agreement in place with Uzbekistan to establish basing rights & already had military leaders draw up a battle plan -- George Tenet & the CIA wouldn't give him the authorization to finalize the deal because they refused to definitively pin the bombings in Sudan & the USS Cole on Osama bin Laden.

So **** you with your bullshit.



Funny.

Clinton authorizes military strikes in Sudan to get Osama bin Laden. It's wag the dog.

If Clinton didn't authrize military strikes in Sudan to get Osama bin Laden. It's he was more interested in getting blowjobs.

LOL!

Talk about a rock & a hard place.

But that's the Republican dichotomy for you.

And either way, the reality is, Clinton did far more than Bush about Osama bin Laden -- & to this day -- is still the president that came closest to killing the guy.

Even when Osama bin Laden virtually unknown to 90% of Americans at the time & despite the fact that Clinton had to fight the Republicans every step of the way in fighting al Qaeda.


The kool aid tasts good today Joe I see.

[shiva2999]

post 113 ??

What the hell are you talking about ?

Here it is, real slow.

Bush was leading a coalition with a mandate to kick Saddam out of Kuwait.

There was no mandate to take out Saddam.

Taking out Saddam with a 9/11 causus belli was planned for Poppy's second term.

[JoeMama]

The kool aid tasts good today Joe I see.

LOL!

Nothing says "white flag" in a debate like tired, cliche' jokes about Kool-Aid.

Especially when it's a one-liner.

[uppy]

Thats lame Shiva...you stand hear jumping up and down saying saying it was

all in the works by Bu$$hco....yet you say the GOP fixes elections.

How in hell did clinton become Prezz then...and how did the demos win

this year ????

Give it up and say you are sorry for being a dumb ass all these years

[uppy]

LOL!

Nothing says "white flag" in a debate like tired, cliche' jokes about Kool-Aid.

Especially when it's a one-liner.


Whats the libby plan now....you won what are your peope going to do Joe


I see a big white flag comming

[shiva2999]

Thats lame Shiva...you stand hear jumping up and down saying saying it was

all in the works by Bu$$hco....yet you say the GOP fixes elections.

How in hell did clinton become Prezz then...and how did the demos win

this year ????

Give it up and say you are sorry for being a dumb ass all these years

The Repubs didn't have the technology to fix 92.

And the Demos won this time because 2/3 of the country hates Bush.

As it is, they still stole millions of votes. It just wasn't enough.

[JoeMama]

Whats the libby plan now....you won what are your peope going to do Joe


I see a big white flag comming

So?

I'm not concerned with appeasing chest-thumping boneheads.

It's you guys that got us bogged down in this hopeless quagmire in the first place.

I'm more concerned with what the Iraqis themselves think.

70% of Iraqis want us out of Iraq right now.

78% of Iraqis think our presence in Iraq is inciting more violence.

So let's get a withdrawl process in place.

[uppy]

You still are not answering the question....why did Bu$$h co wait until

JR was prez ?

[uppy]

So?

I'm not concerned with appeasing chest-thumping boneheads.

It's you guys that got us bogged down in this hopeless quagmire in the first place.

I'm more concerned with what the Iraqis themselves think.

70% of Iraqis want us out of Iraq right now.

78% of Iraqis think our presence in Iraq is inciting more violence.

So let's get a withdrawl process in place.

I don't give a damn what the Iraqis think Joe....we won thay lost.

Game set match

[JoeMama]

I don't give a damn what the Iraqis think Joe....we won thay lost.

Game set match

LOL!

I didn't know we were at war with Iraqi civilians.

Plus, I remember the excuses.

This was about liberation, not occupation.

But now the truth reveals itself.

But hey, I'm just a guy who was smart enough to know Iraq was a bad idea.

[shiva2999]

Upstart is an unabashed imperialist.

He doesn't need reasons to invade other countries.

He's admitted it many times.

[uppy]

You people call it a war joe...think about that for a minute

[uppy]

Upstart is an unabashed imperialist.

He doesn't need reasons to invade other countries.

He's admitted it many times.

Answer the question or STFU

[JoeMama]

Upstart is an unabashed imperialist.

He doesn't need reasons to invade other countries.

He's admitted it many times.

Man, I guess so.

I generally ignore the dumb shit he posts, but I didn't realize he was THIS big a fan of imperialism.

Kind of scary, really.

[shiva2999]

Answer the question or STFU

I answered the question.

Don't play stupid.

It only emboldens the terrorists.

[JLB]

The Repubs didn't have the technology to fix 92.


Ross Perot!

[JoeMama]

The Repubs didn't have the technology to fix 92.



LOL!

That's awesome.

[uppy]

Man, I guess so.

I generally ignore the dumb shit he posts, but I didn't realize he was THIS big a fan of imperialism.

Kind of scary, really.

sorry joe but thay attacked our country

http://fixco1.com/xbush911.jpg

[uppy]

I answered the question.

Don't play stupid.

It only emboldens the terrorists.


You are playing stupid....why ?

[shiva2999]

LOL!

That's awesome.

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0225-05.htm

Increasingly, investigative writers seeking an explanation have looked to Diebold’s history for clues. The electronic voting industry is dominated by only a few corporations – Diebold, Election Systems & Software (ES&S) and Sequoia. Diebold and ES&S combined count an estimated 80% of U.S. black box electronic votes.

In the early 1980s, brothers Bob and Todd Urosevich founded ES&S’s originator, Data Mark. The brothers Urosevich obtained financing from the far-Right Ahmanson family in 1984, which purchased a 68% ownership stake, according to the Omaha World Herald. After brothers William and Robert Ahmanson infused Data Mark with new capital, the name was changed to American Information Systems (AIS). California newspapers have long documented the Ahmanson family’s ties to right-wing evangelical Christian and Republican circles.

In 2001, the Los Angeles Times reported, “. . . primarily funded by evangelical Christians – particularly the wealthy Ahmanson family of Irvine – the [Discovery] institute’s $1-million annual program has produced 25 books, a stream of conferences and more than 100 fellowships for doctoral and postdoctoral research.” The chief philanthropists of the Discovery Institute, that pushes creationist science and education in California, are Howard and Roberta Ahmanson.

According to Group Watch, in the 1980s Howard F. Ahmanson, Jr. was a member of the highly secretive far-Right Council for National Policy, an organization that included Lieutenant Colonel Oliver North, Major General John K. Singlaub and other Iran-Contra scandal notables, as well as former Klan members like Richard Shoff. Ahmanson, heir to a savings and loan fortune, is little reported on in the mainstream U.S. press. But, English papers like The Independent are a bit more forthcoming on Ahmanson’s politics.

“On the right, figures such as Richard Mellon Scaife and Howard Ahmanson have given hundreds of millions of dollars over several decades to political projects both high (setting up the Heritage Foundation think-tank, the driving engine of the Reagan presidency) and low (bankrolling investigations into President Clinton’s sexual indiscretions and the suicide of the White House insider Vincent Foster),” wrote The Independent last November.

The Sunday Mail described an individual as, “. . . a fundamentalist Christian more in the mould of U.S. multi-millionaire Howard Ahmanson, Jr., who uses his fortune to promote so-called traditional family values . . . by waving fortunes under their noses, Ahmanson has the ability to cajole candidates into backing his right-wing Christian agenda.

Ahmanson is also a chief contributor to the Chalcedon Institute that supports the Christian reconstruction movement. The movement’s philosophy advocates, among other things, “mandating the death penalty for homosexuals and drunkards.”

The Ahmanson family sold their shares in American Information Systems to the McCarthy Group and the World Herald Company, Inc. Republican Senator Chuck Hagel disclosed in public documents that he was the Chairman of American Information Systems and claimed between a $1 to 5 million investment in the McCarthy Group. In 1997, American Information Systems purchased Business Records Corp. (BRC), formerly Texas-based election company Cronus Industries, to become ES&S. One of the BRC owners was Carolyn Hunt of the right-wing Hunt oil family, which supplied much of the original money for the Council on National Policy.

In 1996, Hagel became the first elected Republican Nebraska senator in 24 years when he did surprisingly well in an election where the votes were verified by the company he served as chairman and maintained a financial investment. In both the 1996 and 2002 elections, Hagel’s ES&S counted an estimated 80% of his winning votes. Due to the contracting out of services, confidentiality agreements between the State of Nebraska and the company kept this matter out of the public eye. Hagel’s first election victory was described as a “stunning upset” by one Nebraska newspaper.

Hagel’s official biography states, “Prior to his election to the U.S. Senate, Hagel worked in the private sector as the President of McCarthy and Company, an investment banking firm based in Omaha, Nebraska and served as Chairman of the Board of American Information Systems.” During the first Bush presidency, Hagel served as Deputy Director and Chief Operating Officer of the 1990 Economic Summit of Industrialized Nations (G-7 Summit).

Bob Urosevich was the Programmer and CEO at AIS, before being replaced by Hagel. Bob now heads Diebold Election Systems and his brother Todd is a top executive at ES&S. Bob created Diebold’s original electronic voting machine software. Thus, the brothers Urosevich, originally funded by the far Right, figure in the counting of approximately 80% of electronic voting in the United States.

Like Ohio, the State of Maryland was disturbed by the potential for massive electronic voter fraud. The voters of that state were reassured when the state hired SAIC to monitor Diebold’s system. SAIC’s former CEO is Admiral Bill Owens. Owens served as a military aide to both Vice President Dick Cheney and former Defense Secretary Frank Carlucci, who now works with George H.W. Bush at the controversial Carlyle Group. Robert Gates, former CIA Director and close friend of the Bush family, also served on the SAIC Board.

[uppy]

If thats the case how did the demos win this time...lol

[shiva2999]

sorry joe but thay attacked our country

http://fixco1.com/xbush911.jpg

Point out the muslims to me or STFU.

[uppy]

I sorry thay are dead...shit like that happens when you fly a plane into

a building

[shiva2999]

If thats the case how did the demos win this time...lol

I already posted the answer in another thread.

You responded to it.

Why are you wasting my time?

It's not nice.

[shiva2999]

I sorry thay are dead...shit like that happens when you fly a plane into

a building

Thanks for admitting you have nothing but the word of proven liars.

[uppy]

you posted bullshit.....if you wish to debate facts feel free to do so

[uppy]

Thanks for admitting you have nothing but the word of proven liars.

Says you.....lmao

[shiva2999]

you posted bullshit...

Nope.

I never post bullshit.

[shiva2999]

Says you.....lmao

Prove to me that Muslims did it.

[JoeMama]

sorry joe but thay attacked our country

http://fixco1.com/xbush911.jpg

LOL!

Damn those Iraqi civilians for destroying the WTC!!!

[shiva2999]

http://www.fbi.gov/pressrel/speeches/speech041902.htm

Robert S. Mueller, III, Director, FBI
Commonwealth Club of California
San Francisco, CA
April 19, 2002

Thank you, Roy (Eisenhardt) and good afternoon everyone. It's good to be back home. It brings back a lot of wonderful memories. My years in San Francisco were among the most satisfying and enjoyable of my career. It gave me the opportunity to work with some of the finest criminal justice and law enforcement professionals in the country. They taught me a great deal, and it was an honor to serve along side them.
As much as I miss San Francisco, I am grateful to have the opportunity to serve in what I believe to be the world's finest law enforcement agency -- the FBI. It is particularly rewarding to serve at this unparalleled moment in history, when America is depending on the FBI more than ever, when protecting the homeland from terrorist attacks has taken on new meaning and new urgency.

Like most Americans, I'll never forget the day it all began.

...and...

While here, the hijackers did all they could to stay below our radar. They contacted no known terrorist sympathizers. They committed no egregious crimes. They dressed and acted like Americans, shopping and eating at places like Wal-Mart and Pizza Hut, blending into the woodwork all the while. When four got speeding tickets in the days leading up to September 11th, they remained calm and aroused no suspicion. Since none were known terrorists, law enforcement had no reason to question or detain them.

The hijackers also left no paper trail. In our investigation, we have not uncovered a single piece of paper – either here in the U.S. or in the treasure trove of information that has turned up in Afghanistan and elsewhere – that mentioned any aspect of the September 11th plot. The hijackers had no computers, no laptops, no storage media of any kind.

...more...

[г]

I wonder if uppy's ever considered being a "private contracter" in Iraq?

You'd think a guy with his skill set could pull down a couple hundred gees a year working as a merc.

Pancake-flipping never paid that kind of coin...

[Proteus]

Case in point

So I'm hurting the war right now by posting that. You are seriously about the dumbest person I have ever encountered in my life.

[dasaybz]

the few the proud the.....................

Cracked.....

http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/11/22/us.marines/index.html

bullshit

propaganda at its finest

[JLB]

bullshit

propaganda at its finest

Yes it is.

[Proteus]

bullshit

propaganda at its finest

Umm it was the Marine Corps commandant who said it, so how is that propaganda?

[mark3274]

bullshit

propaganda at its finest

Your top commander admits the corp is cracking so live with it..... LMAO

[JLB]

Your top commander admits the corp is cracking so live with it..... LMAO

Exactly what are you laughing about?

[Angus]

You lefties have been aiding and abetting the enemy for 4 years now

don't give me that shit




And you might have noticed the left has been trying to hurt the administration

ability to fight the war on terror from the start...instead of getting behind

the country in a time of war,just like the left did back durring Nam.



I'm not pretending you guys are..you think its all a politcal game and you

hurt this country and it will come back and bite us in the ass when all is

said and done.



Yup and when the congress pulls the funding for the war on terror and

we came home you can take a bow .....when a nuke goes off in one of

our citys.

But...we all know the moonbats will blame Bush

Let me translate what you just wrote for those not conversant in whinespeak:

"Wah, wah, waaaahhhhhhhhh. We started a stupid war with no strategy for reasons that vanished into thin air and now we are going to have to take the blame for the worst foreign policy disaster ever. Its all Cindy Sheehan's fault, not the lack of a post invasion plan, not inadequate troops levels, not the lack of body armor, not the our lies about WMD's. Wah, wah waaaaaaaaaahhhhh, boo hoo, boo hoo, sniffle, sniffle sniffle. That darn Cindy Sheehan. Oh woe is us."

I think the enemy has taken much comfort from the actions of the Bush administration. That is why Osama released a tape just before the 2004 election, to help keep Bush in office. Not my theory by the way but the conclusion of the CIA, not that they know as much as you.

The war in Iraq was a gift to AQ. Saddam hated those guys and they hated him. Iran hated him (you are probably not aware of this but Saddam started a war with Iran that cost millions of lives). We did AQ and Iran a huge favor by taking him and his regime out. At the same time, recruiting for AQ has never been better. The difficult arguement they had been trying to sell is that the US is on a crusade against Islam aided by their Jewish friends in Israel. That arguement got a lot easier after we invaded Iraq. "See?" the AQ recruiters can now say, "we told you so..."

The enemy has been aided and abetted by Americans all right. By Americans like you whose militaristic knee jerk responses to our enemies have played right in to their hands. This game is being played way over your head. Overwhleming violence is a good way to fight the average neighborhood bully, the same approach won't work against a nonconventional enemy that you can't find who attacks you at your weakest using weapons no more sophisticated than a razor blade knife.

Ask the Isreali's how you beat terrorism. They have been fighting terrorism forever and have never elimenated them. That is the future you will give to your country with your incompetent military strategy that does more to satisfy your anger than to accomplish a subtle, cunning and effective anti-terrorism strategy.

The Iraq war thus far has been a colossal failure and it has been exclusively run by the right. Blaming the left rather than admitting your errors of judgment in voting for Bush and his ilk won't change the facts of history.

[uppy]

Ok Angus,what should we do ...close our eyes and hope thay go away ?